Never Make Your Players Have to "Find the Fun"

[AeraLure]

Gameplay that is dictated by timers. It is time for a GATE, have to go do that. It is time for gathering nodes, have to go do that. Haven't capped esoteric tomes this week, have to go do that. Haven't gotten my Void Ark item this week, have to go do that. Haven't done my roulettes today, have to go do that. Have to check the plants. Have to enter my house so it doesn't get demolished. It's a chore list, NOT engaging gameplay.

FIX: Deemphasize content that can only be done at certain times or in certain timeframes. Leave nodes as is (to preserve item rarities), decrease the frequency that players have to check plants, and use RNG instead of time gates to slow progression. That way players can play WHEN they WANT. I feel like FFXIV is telling me when/how to play. I won't continue playing if this pattern continues (yes it has been like this since launch BUT it has gotten worse with every added game system; i.e. it's not just tomes anymore).

Amen. This is my problem with the game. In order to progress, everything is gated and capped in such a way that it really just feels like a chore to play and do. Part of it I realize is the very limited content in which to do so, but in a larger more general sense, the tome system as currently designed really doesn't not inspire fun. The fun I have had with the end game comes from friends in a few LS and the FC. Not the content. I even unsubbed once, even though I'm relatively new to the game (compared to beta and original ARR players) and I don't know if I can stomach a new tome and a repetition of this design. We'll see. I'm working away at it, but, emphasis on work, as I agree with OP that it really doesn't feel like play most of the time.

Remove weekly caps....If I want to run dungeons until my eyes bleed and get all the tomes I can, then why not? We have 13 DoW/DoM jobs and some of us are interested in gearing more than just one job at a time. There's no need to restrict us from being able to properly gear more than one job at a time other than to gate progression in an attempt to make sure we remain subbed for as long as possible. I feel that if the game truly is worthy of a long term sub, gating would be unnecessary as we would have other reasons to want to play then just simply wanting to make sure we do our dailies, and get our weekly drops. I also feel that the one drop a week Void Ark restriction should be removed, but I know that's coming very soon so I won't complain too much about that.

This would help. Not a complete fix, but I might actually start playing other jobs again. As it stands now, having returned from a hiatus, I have retired everything but my main. It's enough to try to get a full tome set and upgrade it for one job, get the relic for one job, and do some crafting and gathering to pay for what the job needs. A second job can be decently equipped as a side result of VA weekly runs for farthings, but not so much if you wish to have multiple jobs in tome gear.

As for the RNG thing, I know most people hate it and condemn it, but I'm with the OP on opinion about it. I know the model is not likely to change for FFXIV, so my example is merely rhetorical, but I loved Phantasy Star Online and its sequels. RNG goodness, yes, but the thing that made me play the game for thousands of hours between editions (and I'd still be playing if only it would get localized again) is that even with its limited content it was always fun to play through things you played a million times because you might get that really rare thing you've been wanting a long time, you might see a rare enemy spawn, but quite often you're going to get some things you already have but it better versions - and - you could still play the game just fine not having max equipment. I think the one lesson FFXIV could learn is that tomes aren't really great motivational rewards for replaying the same content a million times. There needs to be an edge of excitement present each time you run it. PSO had it. FFXIV does not.

That was the advice of a Dungeon's and Dragons DM's guide. And it's advice SE should take to heart.

And this is a fantastic reference. I remember reading that when preparing to DM my first campaign. The reason I love FFXIV is that they do some fights well and they are fun for a little while, but mostly, it's the people I meet and become friends with - and running the same old things with them. That's what keeps me playing. Granted, I'm in a sense creating my own fun through the presence of the people I wish to play with. I think SE could perhaps find some better solutions. Sometimes it feels like even though they design the content, they don't actually play it for months on end non stop like we do, else I think perhaps they'd design it a bit differently.

Finally I want to add: you only criticize what you love. If you don't love it, why bother? Just leave it behind. Things I might say about the game don't mean I am negative about it per se. It just means I can clearly see things I don't like about it and wish would be improved. For whatever reason the OP struck a chord with some of my feelings about the game and why I unsubbed in the first place, although I am indeed back.

[Vivi_Bushido]

I actually thought Diadem was fun personally. It was the communities negative attitude towards it that made it less and less enjoyable.

[Judge_Xero]

That was the advice of a Dungeon's and Dragons DM's guide.

I don't understand. SE basically puts up lighted neon signs with huge arrows that say "this way to fun".

In D&D you may not of had to find the fun but you did have to create it, so you may have the context all wrong especially comparing to a theme park MMO.

[CyrilLucifer]

I actually thought Diadem was fun personally. It was the communities negative attitude towards it that made it less and less enjoyable.

I liked Diadem for about 5 times, but after that I couldn't handle running it anymore due to how it was basically just beating monsters up for hours. That being said, I actually find HM pretty fun when there are two or so competent parties, since it's just the right amount of challenge.

[Kallera]

The OP hits the nail on the head. A lot of the content that is coming for 3.2 feels like noise at this point. I mean, is materia and the latest tomes really going to be that much of a gamemaker?

[hobostew]

I think the real problem here is that a lot of you people don't actually want to play an MMO tbh. If you don't like grinds and find grouping with others inconvenient then this genre is probably not for you.

[MilesSaintboroguh]

I think the real problem here is that a lot of you people don't actually want to play an MMO tbh. If you don't like grinds and find grouping with others inconvenient then this genre is probably not for you.

Or maybe the genre itself isn't as compelling as it once was.

[hobostew]

Or maybe the genre itself isn't as compelling as it once was.

Given the OPs complaint and the general support it's getting I'm pretty sure most of these people wouldn't touch MMOs with a ten foot pole if it ever went back to its niche roots. MMOs of old were even grindier(in fact the grind was 90% of the "compelling" gameplay) and you could do almost nothing without a group.

Mind you I'd argue that since the audience of MMOs of old was so small that it couldn't have been that compelling to the vast majority of people. They were niche games for a reason.

[Alahra]

I never have to find fun in this game. I have a wide variety of goals and things I want to complete or earn, all of which bring me lots of entertainment. And I actually enjoy the current dungeons (and Void Ark) far more than I enjoyed a number of the dungeons we've had over the past year or so. Void Ark is personally my favorite of the 24-mans except for the original LotA (which is still the best, IMO). I liked Diadem too, in theory, but given that the design encouraged zerg-play (yet again), it missed its mark for me. I'm hopeful future Exploratory Missions will be better structured.

If you find aspects of the game to be a chore, it's probably best that you stop doing the things you find to be a chore at your earliest convenience (as I've done with Red Scrips now that I have gear for my three Specalists). If the game still feels like a chore, it's probably that you actually don't like the game anymore and should either quit or take a break from it. The general content model isn't going to change in any significant ways.

Also, I would suggest that you not get dismissive of folks that happen to have a different opinion than you and are enjoying the game, as their enjoyment is just as valid as your lack thereof.

[Andrea]

Personally I left the game only really coming on now and again if a friend needs help with something or to renew the timer on my house ect.

I've been playing BnS/LoL more and so far enjoying them.

I will admit I have put a huge amount of time into FFXIV and while it may be slightly stale now (to me) I still enjoyed the time I spent on the game.

I will most likely come back at 3.2 to see whats changed and see if I enjoy it again/have something to do but atm a break from it is doing good.