Never Make Your Players Have to "Find the Fun"

[Purrfectstorm]

Oh and if you need to remember to enter your house so it doesnt get demolished... Maybe you don't need the house after all?

Let me guess, you're part of the player base who doesn't have a house? It sure would be great if players who aren't using their houses would vacate so the players who want the houses could put them to some better use, right?

Except for one thing, when you buy something, you're not just buying the thing, you're buying the OPTION to use the thing. Let's say that I don't use the house ever. But then one day, I want to plant some Krakka Root. Do you think I'll have a better chance of planting the Krakka Root if I have a house already or if I don't have a house? Would you rather be the player who has a house and doesn't use it (but could if they wanted to) or the player who doesn't have a house and can't do housing related things if you wanted to?

So, yes, I have to remind myself to enter my estate now and then. Even if I'm gardening every day, it's actually entering the house that stops demolition anyway. So I wouldn't assume I'm not "using" my estate just because I'm not using the actual building. I'm not using the actual house btw and never have. There isn't a single piece of furniture in it even after all this time.

[PArcher]

Let me guess, you're part of the player base who doesn't have a house? It sure would be great if players who aren't using their houses would vacate so the players who want the houses could put them to some better use, right?

I have a house, and I think if you have to remember to use it you shouldn't have one either. Let someone who will actually make use of it own it.

[Dyvid]

- Gameplay that is dictated by timers.

Some things are on timers, others on RNG and I see complaints on both ends. You mention dailies task but nothing is actually forcing you do that stuff every day. House is 45 day timer, don't have to do all the roulette's every day, and gardening is something you decided to do.

- Waiting for FATES.

I must not have done this yet because I can't remember waiting on a FATE since ARR days and thought we got rid of that stuff after the CT days. If not I agree it's bad design on SE's part.

- Waiting for groups.

Okay but at some point the game has to be an MMO and not just solo game. That means you have to wait for a group. SE can't force people to run certain things so they add chores and incentives which the community cry's foul every time. Before the new relic quest hardly anyone did HW FATEs for leveling. Now, even after all the complaints, I can level up a job in HW with FATEs and not be the only one doing it.

I think there is growing discontent w/ the status quo

I believe the discontent is from the lack of diversity we have now when compared to 2.XX. HW was an expansion but hasn't really expanded other than tacking on 10 levels. It's still easy dungeons, a trial, and 8-man or 24-man raid. Diadem was a good concept to start a new trend but badly implement and not really fixed in a timely manner. People are also annoying with gear bloating and the process of FFXIV's vertical progress.

We also need more fun content. My favorite content is dungeons but dungeons are boring lately. We need more dungeons like AV or AK. I think 24-person raids are just the worst. They are trolly cesspools of stupidity that last 45 min to 1 hr. We need content to make our chores less repetitive. Why have there been no more 8-person main story dungeons since 2.0? Main Story Roulette is just 2 duties! No good.

Not much SE can do about the trolly cesspool in VA because that's on the community. I agree with 8-person dungeons. I think the problem was from the backlash about cut scenes in those story runs that Yoshi-P got the wrong message and dropped it all together. The problem wasn't the 8-man, it was the cut scenes stopping the gameplay.

TL;DR - Players want to see more depth, more creativity, more engaging gameplay and less standing around bored, less waiting for x to happen, and less building our game routines around a repetitive list of chores. What this game does have going for it is the world and the fact that it's a very pretty game. I think crafting/gathering is more fun than in other games. But right now I don't think this will hold me for much longer if things don't change.

Most is true and we have a real lack of diversity in the game. Yoshi-P said that after 2.XX they would stop playing it safe and try new things. When are we going to actually see this?

[Purrfectstorm]

I must be doing something wrong, I have fun each and everyday I log in and I play this game way too much.

I play this game too much too and it's not even that I never have fun. But there are things that rub me the wrong way ALL THE TIME in this game and make me feel like my gameplay experience is on rails. The system of bonuses (roulettes, challenge log, etc.) and lockouts make me feel this way the most. Not everyone is going to feel like they are missing out if they don't cap tomes this week or get Alexander loot or whatever. But some of us feel that way.

I'm not going to argue what other players find fun or not as that is subjective but many players have voiced complaints in the forums lately so I really don't think I'm alone on this. All I'm asking for is a more flexible game play experience. I don't think waiting around is fun and I don't think having nothing to do because one has exhausted the day's allotment of chores is fun either. You may be fine with it and more power to you if you are.

[Lexia]

So, yes, I have to remind myself to enter my estate now and then. Even if I'm gardening every day, it's actually entering the house that stops demolition anyway. So I wouldn't assume I'm not "using" my estate just because I'm not using the actual building. I'm not using the actual house btw and never have. There isn't a single piece of furniture in it even after all this time.

Cause it must be so hard to enter your house for 2 seconds when you already on the lot doing stuff with the garden.

[Purrfectstorm]

I have a house, and I think if you have to remember to use it you shouldn't have one either. Let someone who will actually make use of it own it.

Using a house and using a plot are 2 separate things. Because of the demolition system, you have to have a house to keep a plot. Also, as I said in my previous post (which you clearly did not read) - I have a house for the option of doing things, which I have a right to have bought and to retain ownership of. A) I paid my sub and B) I paid my gil. No one has a right to my house or plot regardless of what I do with it because of the fact that I bought it and I own it. If they are left out and agitated, they should complain to SE. There is absolutely nothing wrong with people using their property the way they see fit. If I bought a flat screen TV just to smash it to bits, that might offend you, but it's my right. If you don't like what I do with my TV, buy your own TV, and if you can't buy a TV, complain to the people selling TVs, not to the people smashing them.

[Purrfectstorm]

Cause it must be so hard to enter your house for 2 seconds when you already on the lot doing stuff with the garden.

I didn't say it was hard but jealous much? Jesus. This thread isn't about housing. It's not about how hard something is or how long it takes you to do it. It's about ALL THE GAME SYSTEMS THAT REQUIRE YOU TO DO X AT OR BY Y TIME! Stop being so pin-headed to focus on one thing. You probably don't have a house, don't hate on someone that does. It's a nice house too. I'll sell it to you for 100m gil mwahahaha!

[Judah_Brandt]

Hey I just logged into the game. Whoop, found the fun. It was right there. Fun is subjective, stop projecting your opinion and presenting it as fact. You offer little in the way of insight into what you find fun other than many of the functions in this game not being it. It's such a worthless argument.

[Kaiser-Ace]

I have fun with things like leveling my gatherers. It's a break from combat. And I like leveling my combat classes too. (Though some I don't do dungeons with as I find the play styles annoying.)

I find the actual crafting part of crafting annoying as hell but the reward is worth it to me as it's a "No pain no gain" element for me. And learning how to make things is a chore no matter if it's online, irl, or even in another game. Crafting is always a big pain with big payout for time spent.

What I hate are Specialist Crafts and dysenth, The Node System and Aether Reduction, And The Anima and Zodiac Quests that REQUIRE them with out crafters and gatherers needing DoW/DoM for anything.

I'm all for working towards a goal but if I'm going to mindlessly grind a task for a miniscule rewards, work does that and pays ME, so I really don't want to pay someone else for the privilege of doing a full time job in their game.

I wanted Gold Saucer to succeed so bad, but between BS RNG, Dev negligence, and board wide poor execution, there is nothing in Gold Saucer worth the effort. Which makes me actually HOPE that Blitzball (My Favorite FF Minigame) never does get implemented lest they screw it up too like Triple Triad and Chocobo Racing. And gods forbid should they add it and it end up Dead on Arrival like Lords of Verminnion.

The Game is too much of a chore and not enough fun. I want to feel like I'm on an adventure not punching a timecard. And for being "Adventurers" we do little to no Adventuring. Even as the "Warrior of Light" we seem to be doing NPCs chores for them like "Please pick up my drycleaning WoL" when we're suppose to be fighting Phantom Gods, A Tyrannical Empire, and Genocidal Shadow Mages hell bent on reviving their God.

Tl:dr, This is a Game Not a Job, why does it feel like I'm on the time clock when I log in?

[Lexia]

I didn't say it was hard but jealous much? Jesus. This thread isn't about housing. It's not about how hard something is or how long it takes you to do it. It's about ALL THE GAME SYSTEMS THAT REQUIRE YOU TO DO X AT OR BY Y TIME! Stop being so pin-headed to focus on one thing. You probably don't have a house, don't hate on someone that does. It's a nice house too. I'll sell it to you for 100m gil mwahahaha!

Oh you not the one at the top of page 2 getting on the Lalas case about housing? Even though you most likely being sarcastic a GM could come down on you for you selling your house for "100m gil mwahahaha!"