Absolute frustration at not being able to see my own DPS (ps4)

[Gilraen]

So, instead of compromising with a personal parser and actually communicating, the pro-parser group just wants a tool with which to judge others, fairly or otherwise... The people who the original post would think are on his side really aren't, and would just as soon hang him out to dry as they would the anti-parser group. The original post's question is answered.

"That's not fair, noone is saying that!"

On the contrary, the very first post after mine where I reposted the original post in it's entirety says just that. That a personal parser 'isn't enough' and that 'party evaluation' is what's required. Heaven forbid we use chat for chatting.

Please read the post at the top of the previous page as well.

You mean this one?

In a perfect world everybody would be seeking self improvement... but till we reach that point the fear of being called out for playing poorly is one of the best motivators there is.

Many of the players don't care that they are pulling others down, while they have their sweet anonymity, but the second somebody could blame them for it... personally I would rather learn my rotation to avoid risking the abuse.

A good most of those people are trolls though ^^;;

My pages aren't arranged like yours, I'm guessing, cause I have the top of page 10 in my list.

[Ryel]

So, instead of compromising with a personal parser and actually communicating, the pro-parser group just wants a tool with which to judge others, fairly or otherwise...

Please read the post at the top of the previous page as well.

Page34, How can you want equality in options and at the same time wonder why I simply want a toggle?

Um, I don't see how you can't have one without the other. I don't understand how a toggle would prevent someone from doing anything in the post you just stated either "but if you had no idea that you were under-performing before then how would you have any idea whether or not you needed to improve?"
It's called "toggle on" after finding other people to practice with assuming you still needed to toggle on? I cant remember a time I couldn't tell what I was doing wrong in a dungeon without the need of a parser but I could see it happening although you guys seem to think I'm against toggling it on all together and just want a toggle to play devils advocate. With toggle comes the ability to "turn it on".

This thread is a headache, I don't understand why I have to defend wanting a toggle. It's like you guys want to rub parsers into the face of everyone, even those that don't need it, don't want it, or simply only want to toggle it.

This thread is a headache, I'm seriously done guys. I'm sorry we couldn't see eye to eye.

For the record i didn't argue with your asking for a toggle in fact i'm fine with and would welcome it, i was however disputing that you and many others seem to think that people who are pro parser want one because they feel the need to shame and exclude players.

"finding the weakest link" isn't necessarily a negative and nobody is talking about doing it in dungeons, only in progression raid content where performance matters

My pages aren't arranged like yours, I'm guessing, cause I have the top of page 10 in my list.

This Post:#351

[Mycow8me]

So, instead of compromising with a personal parser and actually communicating, the pro-parser group just wants a tool with which to judge others, fairly or otherwise... The people who the original post would think are on his side really aren't, and would just as soon hang him out to dry as they would the anti-parser group. The original post's question is answered.

"That's not fair, noone is saying that!"

On the contrary, the very first post after mine where I reposted the original post in it's entirety, says just that. That a personal parser 'isn't enough' and that 'party evaluation' is what's required. Heaven forbid we use chat for chatting.

/thread, Again though, I'm actually ok with a toggleable parser but otherwise... I'm done. Going to bed.

[Colorful]

/thread, Again though, I'm actually ok with a toggleable parser but otherwise... I'm done. Going to bed.

I suggested a toggleable parser for Party Finder (leader decides), but was met with crazy situations like they might be sick, or whatever. If you're sick and unable to play, you shouldn't be playing.

[zosia]

So, instead of compromising with a personal parser and actually communicating, the pro-parser group just wants a tool with which to judge others, fairly or otherwise... The people who the original post would think are on his side really aren't, and would just as soon hang him out to dry as they would the anti-parser group. The original post's question isanswered.

It's about context and leveling the playing field. A personal dps meter is only useful in certain practices, such as tightening up your own rotation. A personal parser provides no context outside of your own performance. A personal parser does not address that concern.

This thread is about leveling the playing field between PC and ps3/ps4 players. Why do you advocate to keep ps3/ps4 players under privileged? Why do the vast majority of PC players get to see the groups dps while the ps3/ps4 players can only see their own, under your suggestions?

Parsers are a standard in MMO gaming, why do you want to hold this game back for the sake of a safe space when we have tools like black lists and reporting features?

This whole "hung out to dry" nonsense will always exists because jerks will always exist. We keep telling you guys this and you cannot really offer up a reasonable retort against the black list and report harassment argument because those features work very well, especially in this game. The only argument the anti-parser crowd has are outlier cases of unchecked harassment (which I don't believe considering this game's GMs do not take harassment lightly), semantic arguments, and the theoretical chance that parser harassment would sky rocket to the point that GM staff will not be able to manage it.

The pragmatic reality of the situation:
Get harassed? Report the offender, black list them, and save the chat logs so they will get their accounts actioned.
Once that happens a handful of times in the community, there will be no real threat of parser harassment.

What proof do I have of that reality?? Parser harassment gets you banned now and how often do we see parser harassment? Oh, right, it's never brought up in-game since people got banned for parser harassment....

-______- jfc you guys are scared over absolutely nothing.

[Critical-Limit]

I'm not advocating to use parser to "harrass" people. I just think the worse case scenario of someone belittling you with it, doesn't outweigh other people's ability to be equal. I think OP just only wanting personal parser is a step in the right direction, but I don't think it's enough.

We can see when a whm or tank does bad easily. It's magnified, I would say parsers not only makes ps4 equal to PC in full transparency, but it makes jobs equal when it comes to exposing weakness in play. Equality everywhere.

People against parser might as well remain consistent on that ideology and ban report cards. And no seeing the students they'll be just numbers so teachers and fellow students can't "judge" you. That ideal hurts higher learning just like it hurts higher learning in this game.

[Gilraen]

It's about context and leveling the playing field.

All well and good, but that's not what the original post is asking for. All they want is a personal parser, something neither side should have a problem with. I know the ant-parser side doesn't because all we ask is to leave us out of it, you know, "Don't ask, don't tell." A personal parser should be the epitome of 'having your cake and really eating it, too'. But this doesn't seem to satisfy the pro-parser crowd at all, and it's baffling. Anti-parsers aren't going to become irrate if someone asks if they are using a personal parser, they will likely calmly say they don't and the discussion, if everyone is level-headed about it, ends at that. And those who are running personal parsers can chime in and share! Everyone gets their way. The only argument against parsers being personal that I can see is if you want to drag others into it, willingly or not. I get the feeling the original post wants to avoid that, to which I say, "Good on you."

This has already been answered.

Yes, repeatedly, by me and several others. Communicate! Use your words! This is a community, an MMO, not a single-player game!

[Kezy_Kaatapoh]

Snip

This has already been answered. Does a personal parser help some things? Yes. But it doesn't help a lot of things that people do want, namely context to how well you're doing, or assistance in a raid situation of identifying problems. These are real things that only benefit from party wide parsers. You can ignore that if you want, but it's completely reasonable.

To be fair, I'm perfectly ok with making a party wide parser only being viewable in PF content, aka Savage and EX Primals, and making everything else only have a personal parser, but there needs to be a party wide parser of some form in that content.

This topic should have ended after Zosia's last comment. There really is nothing more to be said without missing points or arguing semantics.

Yes, repeatedly, by me and several others. Communicate! Use your words! This is a community, an MMO, not a single-player game!

I have communicated. You didn't actually make an argument though :P At least not one that hasn't already been answered. You actually didn't even respond to any of the things in my post that directly responded to your question and concern.

[randysquirrel]

I suggested a toggleable parser for Party Finder (leader decides), but was met with crazy situations like they might be sick, or whatever. If you're sick and unable to play, you shouldn't be playing.

the problem with a parser is that it might be on, and a pigeon flew in my window and poked one of the buttons, this made my rotation go off and I have a bird allergy and then I got lag, and my number was low, and you might kick me because you didn't know

so we must never have anything like a parser in case of stuff like this

[Critical-Limit]

All well and good, but that's not what the original post is asking for."

Apparently you weren't reading that there are people against even just a personal parse because that allows for discussion. Boss enrages. Ok who's lacking on damage. People who know they do good will post it immediately. People who lack might hold back on that info. They want this possible scenario to not even exist. Cuz allowing people to talk about parsers can allow people to ask your numbers

There is a reason people want to see other dPS. It's called accountability and that will still be something a FC PC leader can use. If you're a PS4 player food luck trying to lead your raid group blind to who is lacking and needs help.