HARD four-man dungeons

[Kogasan]

Yes please SE consider 4 man endgame raids like these people speak of.

[Kitfox]

The game is not all that balanced for 4-man parties. WAR would be the only tank for example. If you're truly talking about HARD, raid tier, content, then those class discrepancies become even more highlighted because of the smaller party size. Some aspects of the encounters would have to be simplified to fit a wider range of different parties, because a light party can't fill all the usual roles. I think SE also mentioned something about not wanting to place all the burden on the single healer in the party, but they say a lot of things...

[Arrak]

The challenge mode idea is from WoW. All dungeons have a heroic and challenge setting. Heroic is just max level, harder content. Basically what S/E does with the "hard mode" dungeons. Challenge mode is a more challenging version of the same dungeons. You start out with a barrier preventing you from moving forward and control when the dungeon "begins". Once it begins, a clock starts ticking. The idea is to come up with strategies to either skip trash mobs or find ways to pull them quickly without your tank dying. I quit WoW back in MoP so I'm not sure exactly how the WoD challenge modes were, but I do know that completing them seemed a bit easier. There were four achievements to be gained. Clearing it. Bronze Time. Silver Time. Gold Time. Getting gold in challenge mode was something that only raiders could really accomplish... very well coordinated groups. Getting all Bronze, All Gold etc, each gave you another meta achievement that earned rewards like titles and mounts. This would be fun to have in FFXIV considering everyone already tries to speed pull dungeons. Beef them up and let players figure out the fastest ways to get past trash and clear bosses. And having it based on timed clears doesn't gate it ostracizing non-raiders and lesser skilled players.

[ruskie]

Yes please. Hard 4 mans for current ilivl would be nice.

[Shyluv]

Healers already single heal in 8 man raids anyway.

I've gone into coil, unsynced with some friends who hadn't done coil before. I didn't tell them anything about it, and let them figure things out themselves. Even though it was unsynced, it was just us 4. So it was a bit challenging. But it way very fun.

[MaethusXion]

I've been curious about is what pre-nerf AK and PS (and anything else) were like: bam, we got AK Savage and PS Savage for instant ideas!

Pre-nerf AK wasn't really that hard. The 2nd and 3rd bosses were heavy on DPS checks(Gnats on Wall, Statues on final boss). What made pre-nerf PS hard was people trying to ignore mechanics/adds on the first and last bosses.

I still don't understand why they removed the bees from from Demon Wall or reduced the damage on Imminent Catastrophe in Anantaboga. Please give us more difficult dungeons SE.

Gnats.

[Ageofwar]

while it would be nice to have a hard dungeon that is not part of the main story there is a reason we can't have nice things.

lets take "The Steps of Faith" for example which when it first came out it was pretty hard for a DF group that refused to work together, which got the hell nerfed out of it at the communities request. the other issue was that it was part of the story

I fear that if SE release anything even a tiny bit hard in a dungeon it will get the crap nerf out of it by community request since no one will do the content.

[Felis]

Yoshida said already no to harder 4 man dungeons, but a maybe to 4 man raids.

[Shyluv]

while it would be nice to have a hard dungeon that is not part of the main story there is a reason we can't have nice things.

lets take "The Steps of Faith" for example which when it first came out it was pretty hard for a DF group that refused to work together, which got the hell nerfed out of it at the communities request. the other issue was that it was part of the story

I fear that if SE release anything even a tiny bit hard in a dungeon it will get the crap nerf out of it by community request since no one will do the content.

Steps was still 8 man, not 4. And considering that story is casual content, it was harder than it should have been, no matter how easy some people thought it was.

If they make four man raids and design it to be difficult from the first place, people know what they are getting into from the start.

[Ageofwar]

Snip

you are correct it was a 8 man trial not a 4 man dungeon also Step was quite easy pre-nerf if the group communicated
a better example would be Amdapor keep normal which was also nerf (admittedly after some time to fit it in with the DR)


If SE does a hard dungeon as long as SE doesn't make it part of the MSQ and leave it un-nerf for at least 3 main patches it will be fine