[dev1017] Materia crafting system & Materia: A Matter of Mystery (08/26/2011)

[Arximiro]

Another question I have is how will this all be sellable in the wards? Will every single materia have a listing? That wouldn't be too bad, but what about gear imbued with materia? We have been told that as well will be sellable. That would be a complete nightmare to sell with the current ward system.

I see this turning into a shout to sell system at least for the short-term. With all the possible materia combinations on armor, I don't even see a way they could implement it into this market system. They would have to completely redo the system to make it display like a bazarr where we can view each individual item.

[MeowyWowie]

What confuses me even more is that Forbidden Materia Craft is meant for the hardcore players, the same players who will blow through content much quicker than casual players and in effect get to have their "elite" feeling of having gear before everyone else, as Yoshi P himself has stated.

How are they supposed to feel superior if the gear they've acquired is inferior to crafted gear? Doesn't make sense at all.

[MeowyWowie]

Another question I have is how will this all be sellable in the wards? Will every single materia have a listing? That wouldn't be too bad, but what about gear imbued with materia? We have been told that as well will be sellable. That would be a complete nightmare to sell with the current ward system.

I see this turning into a shout to sell system at least for the short-term. With all the possible materia combinations on armor, I don't even see a way they could implement it into this market system. They would have to completely redo the system to make it display like a bazarr where we can view each individual item.

Yea I agree, I haven't even begun to try and wrap my mind around this yet.

[Arcell]

What confuses me even more is that Forbidden Materia Craft is meant for the hardcore players, the same players who will blow through content much quicker than casual players and in effect get to have their "elite" feeling of having gear before everyone else, as Yoshi P himself has stated.

How are they supposed to feel superior if the gear they've acquired is inferior to crafted gear? Doesn't make sense at all.

Well the way I read it, the only materia they're taking into consideration for balance issues is the first. This means that at a base level crafted gear will still be inferior and that even with a single materia it may still be inferior or at best of the same level.

The people who take the time, effort and patience to slot more than that get rewarded as they should. Every time they attach another piece they have a chance of losing EVERYTHING. Depending on how the success rates are, this would make 5-slotted gear an exceptionally rare occurrence which would mean that not nearly everyone's going to have it. If the success rates are low enough, this would mean few people would have the desire to slot more materia than one.

This in turn does make the U/U gear still worth it as you have superior stats with none of the fuss. Those who don't want to waste their time and resources attaching materia won't have to.

Edit: Also consider that not all slots can accept all materia. The Dungeon/NM gear could have bonuses that would be impossible with materia.

[Xenor]

Another question I have is how will this all be sellable in the wards? Will every single materia have a listing? That wouldn't be too bad, but what about gear imbued with materia? We have been told that as well will be sellable. That would be a complete nightmare to sell with the current ward system.

I see this turning into a shout to sell system at least for the short-term. With all the possible materia combinations on armor, I don't even see a way they could implement it into this market system. They would have to completely redo the system to make it display like a bazarr where we can view each individual item.

It's obvious that it will just stay the way it is and you will have to check every single item that shows up in the search. It will be like the current situation when there's more than 20 for sale, you'll be doing that for everything. It's a shame that the flawed market system will take the fun out of what is looking to be a great new economy.

[MeowyWowie]

Well the way I read it, the only materia they're taking into consideration for balance issues is the first. This means that at a base level crafted gear will still be inferior and that even with a single materia it may still be inferior or at best of the same level.

The people who take the time, effort and patience to slot more than that get rewarded as they should. Every time they attach another piece they have a chance of losing EVERYTHING. Depending on how the success rates are, this would make 5-slotted gear an exceptionally rare occurrence which would mean that not nearly everyone's going to have it. If the success rates are low enough, this would mean few people would have the desire to slot more materia than one.

This in turn does make the U/U gear still worth it as you have superior stats with none of the fuss. Those who don't want to waste their time and resources attaching materia won't have to.

Edit: Also consider that not all slots can accept all materia. The Dungeon/NM gear could have bonuses that would be impossible with materia.

So basically hardcore is more about gil than skill. The reason I say this is because a person with hundreds of millions of gil won't be affected much by the failure rate as they'll always be able to buy the equipment and/or materia again and keep trying. Eventually they will reach their goal, not because they're better players, but because they can afford to dump millions on their gear. That's a bad system, even the ex-FFXI crowd would agree I think.

Honestly I see soooo many problems with this it's unfathomable, and I don't mean just gil-based elitism. But I'm going to wait and see exactly how it's implemented before I post my theories. We've all seen what happens on these forums when someone posts something that isn't confirmed, so I'll just save myself the headache.

I really, really hope Yoshi P and the devs thought this through entirely.. It has the potential to be a great system, but at the same time has the potential to destroy the game as well.

Edit: I'm fairly sure what he meant about 1 materia gear being the basis of game balance has nothing to do with r/ex gear. He meant that content difficulty would be balanced in accordance to players equipped with gear that has 1 materia in it.

And as far as slots go, he just meant that accessories can't be enhanced.

[Arcell]

I really, really hope Yoshi P and the devs thought this through entirely.. It has the potential to be a great system, but at the same time has the potential to destroy the game as well.

Well they are professional game developers. I mean this is what they do all day, for a living. You have to be of the mindset of looking for all potential flaws in something if you're in development.

Even if you could slot materia into U/U gear, there would still be gil-based elitism. It would just mean they'd be able buy all the materia they want and start slotting as soon as they got the gear. It would take a little longer but with enough gil you can skip the materia generation process. The only way to completely eliminate gil-based elitism for this system would be to make all materia Untradable and all gear with materia in it Untradable. Then you would only have the profits of your own work. Though even then the people with the most gil could simply acquire the best materia converting gear faster so even that's out.

[MeowyWowie]

HQ gear can be obtained by purhasing it, which takes 0 skill at all. R/EX gear must be obtained through natural means, which usually involves skill.

Yea, either way, both systems will allow for wealthier players to gain the upper hand. But the former is more manipulative if you ask me, requiring 0 skill at all.

[Viridiana]

Well the way I read it, the only materia they're taking into consideration for balance issues is the first. This means that at a base level crafted gear will still be inferior and that even with a single materia it may still be inferior or at best of the same level.

I think they meant that more as "You should be able to clear new content with only one materia per slot, give or take." Not, "New dungeon gear will be more or less balanced against crafted gear + one materia."

I find myself agreeing with Meowy on this one. If current trends continue, crafted gear will not only be just plain better, but will also have room to grow and further exceed the dungeon gear. Literally the only point I'm seeing for dungeon gear (aside from maybe the occasional BIS piece) is as a backup to whatever you're trying to multi-inlay. . .

[Heaven]

For those wondering about adding materia to unique/untradable gear, here's my take on it:

Attach requirements:

"In order to attach materia to a certain piece of equipment, Disciples of the Hand must fulfill the class and level requirements for crafting it."

Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/277

So for Example; Iron longsword is a blacksmith 45 recipe, so you need to be a level 45 blacksmith in order to attach materia to it. Something like a Templar's Haubergeon has no crafting recipe on it therefore it does not meet the requirements to attach materia.

That's how I read it.