I don't want to tank dungeons anymore...

[Suirieko]

Apparently you haven't played the newer dungeons where they created locks so you couldn't grab the entire first half of the dungeon at once.

Even when there's locks, there's still at least 5 to 10 mopbs to pull. So what to do? Let's grab them all at once so they can killed be as quickly as possible. At least it's less absurd than when Amdapor keep first came out lol.

[Malevicton]

A tank who is keeping hate, but pulling at a slower pace is doing their job. That's the bottom line. If you only want to run with speed-runing tanks, holy-WHMs and awesome DPS, form your own static. Expecting spectacular groups from DF who are all on the same page is setting yourself up for a bad time. Some groups in DF are cool, some are a bit rough around the edges. That's just how it's going to be when running with random players of varying skill levels.

Keeping hate is an absolute bare minimum. A pld can hold tank through any dungeon using only flash, but that would be a pretty bad tank by any stretch of the imagination. Everyone has different expectations, but can they please be higher than technically-not-so-bad-as-to-kill-us-on-trash? Because that's extremely low. I have a static, but I shouldn't need to form a static to get basic competency in faceroll content.

I'm not expecting everyone to be spectacular. I'm expecting them to be playing the game, and if you are then you'll be fine. Most baddies at 60 are just watching netflix, or eating while playing. The amount of people who are just not legitimately skilled enough to handle more than the slowest possible pace is extremely low.

Apparently you haven't played the newer dungeons where they created locks so you couldn't grab the entire first half of the dungeon at once.

lol. I've been playing since 2.0 (+1blm lfg wp sr all day) and have done the newer dungeons plenty since there's nothing else to do. You can still pull like 10 mobs, just not whole dungeons up to the boss. Why would that mean devs designed everything around minimal pulls? (Spoiler: it doesn't mean that at all)

So let's try again. Someone show me the dev statement where the devs say the original design of current dungeons is to pull as small of groups as possible? If there's no such statement to be found, then it's actually just your opinion and you should refer to it as such instead of as "the intended design of the game"

[SonKevin]

God forbid SE gives us some challenging instead of continuously coddling to new players. God forbid tanks have to deal with 10 mobs in challenging situations.They called it a "challenge" for a reason, and a large group of mobs tests how many mobs a tank can hold, as well as how well the healer can heal the tank, as well as how fast the DDs kill the mobs.

From where I come from, FFXIV endgame is full of nasty people. That's the reason endgame attendance is so low in the NA FFXIV servers. NA FFXIV is full of nasty, nasty players. And challenge? That's silly. It's pretty much pointless to pull large groups if you don't have an AOE DPS. They're still single targeting and the tank and healer are doing more work when they could be helping kill the mobs. There is literally nothing challenging about holding a large group of mods. All I need to do is Flash spam and use Riot Blade. Nothing will leave my aggro.

[Zenji]

Ok let's be honest though. I'm all for normal paced dungeon running, but when you have a tank that takes forever to pull a mobs and bosses, it gets extremely annoying. Good tanks and partys could clear dungeons no problem without stalling after every single pull. There's no need for that.

[KingOfAbyss]

The point you praised was this: "Go ahead and pull mobs ahead of me when I'm tanking. I have other things to do and don't mind leaving. How's that extra time waiting fora replacement tank working for your speed run now?" I get that people pulling ahead is annoying, but it's a minor annoyance at worst. Run up and unleash, everything's good again. If you're going to try and punish your group by using q times, then you're using your position as tank to hold the group hostage. And just plain being a dick.

Someone being immature towards you (like pulling extra stuff) does not give license to be immature to them ("well then screw u enjoy q times!"). All that means is that 2 people were immature instead of 1.

What if I want passable dps? Or a whm that knows what holy is? I can't do all 4 roles myself, so expecting some degree of competency from my party members isn't so much to ask.

I don't want to tank. Not because it's high stress (it's really not). I did it for years. I'm tired of it. I'm not gonna do it just because so many other people are bad at it. It's not what I enjoy. Why does that mean I don't get any say in how my group's handle stuff? I'm still 1/4 of the party regardless.

But apparently that means I'm saying people should be assholes in game -.-

Hopefully not assholes, but me and my GF count for 2/4 if you are 1/4. Does that means I (we) will have the big head? Not at all.

I'm asking to get along, nicely, each one doing it's best that he can, having fun in the process. (Some players, be it Tank, Support, Healer, DPS, you name it, somes are bad, somes are elite.)

You view yourself as elite? Create your own groups and voilà! Problem solved for the rest of your life.

You cannot? Well, sorry you will end up playing with me.

You are eager to show the world (we are only 3 with you) that you have uber DPS numbers? Wait till the Tank gets aggro, and then please, have fun ^^ <-- That's Courtesy, and how it should be. *what is 'passable' DPS??

You said it, you're not going to do it because somes are bad in your point of view. Then help them by not aggroing more than he can chew, not pulling before him/her, staying at your place and wait (oh no I said a taboo word on the forum!) and then he'll gain confidence and improve.. Not the other way around, that makes OP want to quit Tanking.. >.<

If I'm pulling, getting some Flash, and then you start killing, and then we move on to the next group.. if there is a BRD, MCH, BLM, SMN, I will try to pull more, taking that I will know the dungeon so well that I know what's coming, so the pace will of course be a bit faster..

But with 2 melee? It's faster to try to chain pull, taking into account they would both of them (impossible these days) attack the same mob, and the healer can join them, this will go more quickly.. then being spread out >.<

So it goes down to: You can TANK but don't want to, that is YOUR choice. You are then at the mercy of those that takes up the role. Some will go the way you like, and you'll need to accept those that doesn't. Else Help them, if you don't want to: accept. <-- nothing else here is left.

I pray for you to get only decent people, but since the start of 2.0, If seen all people from all the spectrum, from bad to elite, and I adjusted accordingly, having fun meanwhile.

And you have it good about the immature part: they will always starts offending, but you the Tank, must be so much mature and over the little stuff that, you must accept everything and respond into a mature way. <-- B.S.

If you don't have fun in a specific party, don't kick; just leave. That's courtesy.

EDIT: on another post, you wrote:

Most baddies at 60 are just watching netflix, or eating while playing.

Well yeah, I agree with you, that ain't courtesy at all, same as being half-asleep or drink or.. >.< sadly, we cannot see what's going on, on their side..

worst case: we got a Tank (was DPS) that was watching his wife on AS3.. o.O just watch her, play with her, or be with us, but choose! GRRR

[SonKevin]

So forgive me when I'm cynical, when it comes to self-righteous tanks that think they're shit just because they think they're a rare commodity.

I spend A LOT of time in DF. I enjoy doing dungeons a lot. I've seen everyone leave. However, I will admit my perspective is skewed. I usually don't have to deal with bad tanks because I'm simply the tank. When I'm a healer, I don't have to deal with bad healers because I'm the healer. So I see far more healers leaving parties, but your examples were bad because everyone left those. If you completed once, you didn't want to do it again.

[Zojha]

I think it's time to revamp that very first guildhest you get: "Enemy groups".

Instead of having two groups and telling people to take them one at a time, fill the entire room with groups and have the Battlewarden go:"We wanna get out of here ASAP so take them all on at once. You have ten seconds before I lose my patience with you."

Then have the ten second timer run down in an overly dramatic way right in the middle of the screen and "end" the guildhest with a failure if you don't have all mobs picked up.

[Atoli]

A tank who is keeping hate, but pulling at a slower pace is doing their job. That's the bottom line.

Why should we tolerate tanks that do the bare minimum when we do not accept dps and healers doing the bare minimum?
The infamous "ice mage" is also doing his job, dealing dmg. The dmg is indefinitely lower than what a BLM could put out, but technically, he's still doing what a dps is supposed to do.
Yet most of the community rages about players like that and would not put up with such behaviour. Why is it acceptable for a tank to only do the bare minimum of holding threat on a small group of monsters?
Once again, it boils down to the "but we have few tanks!"-privilege.

Then have the ten second timer run down in an overly dramatic way right in the middle of the screen and "end" the guildhest with a failure if you don't have all mobs picked up.

God forbid we have low-level content that actually challenges players to play their roles..xD

[Cylestea]

Simple way to solve this if you want speed runs do Party finder. if not dont complain what you get in roulette its up to the tank to choose pulling speed. what if the tank is a fresh 60 and needs gear still? they will get rekted pulling to much at once cause dps is RUSH RUSH RUSH

[Suirieko]

From where I come from, FFXIV endgame is full of nasty people. That's the reason endgame attendance is so low in the NA FFXIV servers. NA FFXIV is full of nasty, nasty players. And challenge? That's silly. It's pretty much pointless to pull large groups if you don't have an AOE DPS. They're still single targeting and the tank and healer are doing more work when they could be helping kill the mobs.

Crowd control DDs can kill a group of mobs at a faster pace, but tend to be a little slower at single targets. However, single target DDs can kill mobs one at at a time at a very fast pace.

There is literally nothing challenging about holding a large group of mods. All I need to do is Flash spam and use Riot Blade. Nothing will leave my aggro.

Great, but apparently for other tanks, it is, and that's why they want slower dungeons.

and yes, I agree, FFXIv is full of rude people. I'm one of them that tries to go out of the way to be nice, believe it or not.