Does instant transportation effect game immersion?

[weeble]

nooo way in eorzia does instant boat rides or instant ports to specific locations hurt anything in game. ask yourself either way what is there to do at these locations? just leves. leves to me aren't even content ..it's a joke if they think they can just keep adding leves as content either way. they will need to add new things that take us past each crystal, from grinds that are 5-10min runs from there, to dungeons u need to make way to, or the quest spots they take us too ...they will all be the right 5-10mins away. ...running any farther specially for repeatable things like leves or locals ...is just dumb.

[Mikita]

I was pretty scared when I first entered Mor Dhona and got chased for about 2 miles by a giant toad. I didn't want to have to return to Limsa and spend another 30 minutes running back again if it caught and killed me

What resulted in that first trip to Mor Dhona was me and 2 other people from my LS attempting to cross Mor Dhona from the south all the way to the north to move into Coerthas, just so we could admire the scenery and get some idea of where we'd end up in a few months time once we all hit r50.

At one point we all switched to gathering tools and swimsuits and started throwing rocks at a drake to see which one of us it could manage to catch, then one of the two survivors had to try and raise that person without getting aggro. Why did we do this? Simple, it was fun, and extremely funny. (Did I mention most of the enemies in Mor Dhona aggro on sight?). And by sight I mean quite literally, they only aggro if they look at you whilst you're in range, so you can actually run past them like, 5 feet away as long as they're looking the other way. It's pretty intense trying to run past a rank 90 Basilisk in an enclosed corridor of rocks, and knowing at any second it could turn around and chomp you, and that your corpse would end up too close to it to be raised by your friends.

But anyways, this game doesn't hand you immersion, fun and excitement on a plate, but it gives you the means and tools to find it yourself. If you want to go adventuring and exploring, you can. There's quite a few hidden nooks and crannies scattered around the various landscapes that you probably never knew were there, heck, I found a cave in Thanalan the other day with a pool and quarry point and weird glowing flowers that looked like chinese lanterns. 3 weeks running around in Thanalan before I found that. No doubt there's other wonders around that people don't know about, the same as there could still be crafting recipes or items of clothing that have yet to be discovered.

Don't expect the game to give you your adventure, go and find it for yourself, that's what makes it YOUR adventure.

So I guess in a way instant teleporting can affect the games immersion, because you may miss these hidden little bits and pieces, but it's up to you if you want to teleport, or run there and maybe find something interesting.

Great post!

We can let teleporting ruin our immersion -- or not. It's really up to us.
To me teleporting is a great convenience and I hope SE keeps it as an option.

My little story:

Last night 20 people from my LS wanted to take a picture together in a place we'd never been to before.
So we all gathered in Ul'dah, split into 3 parties and teleported over to Nine Ivies. We'd all been to Nine Ivies before, so being able to teleport there was simply a great time saver.

From there is where the adventure began.
We ran east, trying to get to Larkscall -- a place none of us have been before.

The Efts and Buzzards along the way were no problem, but then we ran into Hellbenders that started 1-shotting people left and right while other people tried to raise them or run past. In all, only 8 people made it to Larkscall (I wasn't one of them).

It was pretty crazy, but it was a lot of fun. ^^

Giving up on getting 20 people to Larkscall, we then teleported to Dragonhead -- another place we all know well. But instead of heading south to Dzemael, we headed north to Prominence Point.

That was the first time most of us have seen Ishgard, and it was a marvelous sight!
We got a lot of great pictures and all had quite a bit of fun together all night.

Eorzea is huge. There are so many places to explore if you only go looking. ^^

[Konachibi]

Y'see, plenty of immersion in this game even with the teleport system. We go and find our own adventures.

In games like Warcraft there is no teleport system apart from the Hearthstone, but people never have these little stories to share like we get in FFXIV, because games like Warcraft give you so much easy 'here go and do this' stuff that you never feel like you have time to stop and smell the roses, or investigate that glowing thing off in the distance to see if there's anything there, so essentially although we spend more time running around and travelling in those kinds of games, it lacks immersion because it gives no reason for people to venture off the beaten track to see what's what.

In Final Fantasy games, both old and new, online and single-player, wandering around and ignoring the storyline for a few hours, or even days, can reap benefits you'd have never even realised, even if it's just a fun tale to tell people, it's still better than "Oh well y'know I spent all day questing, yeah I gained like, 5 levels, nothing interesting happened though."

[Davorok]

sorry, and not trying to be one of the stupid people either, just throwing my opinions out on the forums but. dynamic ... ever changing worlds of mmorpg? please do tell what that means and the diff from offline games... the only thing in a mmo that makes it ever changing is people ...stupid people, smart people, different people. it is the only thing that changes for the most part.

In FFXI, there was Conquest, Besieged and Campaign which determined what rewards/items were offered for sale/trade in the main cities and for what prices. They were dependent on player participation to affect the outcome and the "political layout" of the land. Vanadiel was Dynamic and ever-changing.

If several parties are grinding in a particular area, it makes traveling through that area less dangerous and easier to get a raise, a cure or a /help response. My gameplay is affected by other players actions (for better or worse) and I like it that way. I enjoy MMO's because the world changes because of my actions and the actions of others. Kinda makes it more realistic than a single player rpg can ever be. (I know realism in a fantasy world is an oxymoron but I require some reality to suspend my sense of disbelief).

MMO's also tend to have major updates/expansions that change the game world and mechanics quite drastically, even changing the classes/jobs to reflect the game world changes, whereas offline-rpg's generally just add new high-level missions if they get any updates at all. (All FF games are complete, done, fini, except for XI & XIV so I prefer mmo final fantasy over the finality of console FF).

My post was just an attempt at humor to take a jab at the whole "Immersion" aspect of gaming. Game mechanics do not ruin my immersion. A party member giving a movie review of Cowboys vs Aliens ruins my immersion, as does the inevitable LS chat conversation about your favorite FF game of all time... for the 1012th time.

I enjoy grouping up with others to complete in-game objectives. I just don't want to hear about what your watching on TV or how your date went last night. That's all I'm sayin' ;>)

[Konachibi]

In FFXI, there was Conquest, Besieged and Campaign which determined what rewards/items were offered for sale/trade in the main cities and for what prices. They were dependent on player participation to affect the outcome and the "political layout" of the land. Vanadiel was Dynamic and ever-changing.

If several parties are grinding in a particular area, it makes traveling through that area less dangerous and easier to get a raise, a cure or a /help response. My gameplay is affected by other players actions (for better or worse) and I like it that way. I enjoy MMO's because the world changes because of my actions and the actions of others. Kinda makes it more realistic than a single player rpg can ever be. (I know realism in a fantasy world is an oxymoron but I require some reality to suspend my sense of disbelief).

MMO's also tend to have major updates/expansions that change the game world and mechanics quite drastically, even changing the classes/jobs to reflect the game world changes, whereas offline-rpg's generally just add new high-level missions if they get any updates at all. (All FF games are complete, done, fini, except for XI & XIV so I prefer mmo final fantasy over the finality of console FF).

My post was just an attempt at humor to take a jab at the whole "Immersion" aspect of gaming. Game mechanics do not ruin my immersion. A party member giving a movie review of Cowboys vs Aliens ruins my immersion, as does the inevitable LS chat conversation about your favorite FF game of all time... for the 1012th time.

I enjoy grouping up with others to complete in-game objectives. I just don't want to hear about what your watching on TV or how your date went last night. That's all I'm sayin' ;>)

Run for President, you've got my vote!

[Azurymber]

Run for President, you've got my vote!

and my axe!

[Bled]

And I'm back. Here you go.

I do not know why you think Immersion is subjective but here i will quote myself back slew of pages with what psychological gaming immersion is.

Immersion aka Spacial Presence

Completeness of sensory information (aka visuals) means that the fewer imperfections about the mental model of the game world that the player has to fill in, the better like big arrows for quests, and instant teleports with no travel time to speak of. Abstractions (there are no people in this town because of, uh, a genocide!) are the enemy of immersion. Assassin’s Creed 2 was immersive because its towns were filled with people who looked like they were doing people stuff, actual daily tasks. Dealing in a familiar environment also allows everyone to comfortably make assumptions about those blank spaces without being pulled out of the world to think about it like copy pasting areas over and over again in FF14. Knowing that the world is not a copy paste but rather a different piece of a puzzle allows you to be more immersed in the game.

Cognitively demanding environments where you stop and think causes the player base to focus on what’s going on and getting by in the game will tie up mental resources. This is good for immersion, because if the brain is used for understanding or moving around in the world, it’s not free to notice all its problems or shortcomings that would otherwise remind them that they’re playing a game like instant teleport forces on people.

Finally, a strong and interesting narrative, plot, or story will suck you in every time no matter who you are. In fact, it’s pretty much the only thing in a book’s arsenal for creating immersion and look at the long running of books! it works in games too! Good stories attract attention to the game and make the world seem more believable. They also tie up those mental resources I spoke of earlier in avoiding notice of other game flaws.

Your aspect of immersion you keep bringing up "ideling" is a portion of time were you are taking in sensory information allowing you to use more of those mental resources. Today's crowd of gamers is so impatient, so greedy, and so ignorant that they cant help but not appreciate immersion; does this lack of patience and appreciation of quality come from something outside of the gaming world, yes i do believe so... i pin this on American culture.

I just don't understand how a person of your intellectual prowess could think that immersion can not be measure and defined aka subjective. I do not agree with your statement "Content can add immersion. Immersion for immersion sake is not content", Content does not all ways add immersion for instance insta porting is content and yet creates no immersion. yet you are correct immersion is developed in a game through content so you can not have immersion without content; Immersion is a product of content, however content can have no immersion.

they don't need to be balanced, mechanics breed immersion. Like i said mechanics do not always breed immersion.

there is a communication breakdown here and I should've been more descriptive. yep i agree with that.

I'm taking the photograph of the earth with the hubble telescope. You're taking a photograph of the place you live. i do not agree with this and again maybe this was a result in a communication break down. I am advocating IMMERSION! in Final Fantasy 14 not the whole game, in this discussion. When i stated you are not looking at the big picture i meant you are disregarding a legitimate game mechanic (immersion) all together by stating it is a subjective mechanic.

You can't, you'll have losses. I'm okay with these losses as an open game will be conducive to more people's interests as they'll be able to access it more. Yes and when you open your self up for more interests you can shut everyone out at the same time. It is just not smart marketing to try and target every demographic and expect to even please half of each demographic thus resulting in profit, that is just not realistic. "We got a rushed product, not a half assed one." It was half assed because it was rushed, but even still how do you define rushed seeing as Hiromichi Tanaka had 5 years to develop the game.. and a previous game under his belt. When you target to many demographics you are more apt to create a sloppy product. Simple marketing strategy you play to your strengths and you develop a product that has a target demographic not all demographics...

[Rhomagus]

I do not know why you think Immersion is subjective but here i will quote myself back slew of pages with what psychological gaming immersion is.

Immersion aka Spacial Presence

Completeness of sensory information (aka visuals) means that the fewer imperfections about the mental model of the game world that the player has to fill in, the better like big arrows for quests, and instant teleports with no travel time to speak of. Abstractions (there are no people in this town because of, uh, a genocide!) are the enemy of immersion. Assassin’s Creed 2 was immersive because its towns were filled with people who looked like they were doing people stuff, actual daily tasks. Dealing in a familiar environment also allows everyone to comfortably make assumptions about those blank spaces without being pulled out of the world to think about it like copy pasting areas over and over again in FF14. Knowing that the world is not a copy paste but rather a different piece of a puzzle allows you to be more immersed in the game.

Cognitively demanding environments where you stop and think causes the player base to focus on what’s going on and getting by in the game will tie up mental resources. This is good for immersion, because if the brain is used for understanding or moving around in the world, it’s not free to notice all its problems or shortcomings that would otherwise remind them that they’re playing a game like instant teleport forces on people.

Finally, a strong and interesting narrative, plot, or story will suck you in every time no matter who you are. In fact, it’s pretty much the only thing in a book’s arsenal for creating immersion and look at the long running of books! it works in games too! Good stories attract attention to the game and make the world seem more believable. They also tie up those mental resources I spoke of earlier in avoiding notice of other game flaws.

Your aspect of immersion you keep bringing up "ideling" is a portion of time were you are taking in sensory information allowing you to use more of those mental resources. Today's crowd of gamers is so impatient, so greedy, and so ignorant that they cant help but not appreciate immersion; does this lack of patience and appreciation of quality come from something outside of the gaming world, yes i do believe so... i pin this on American culture.

I just don't understand how a person of your intellectual prowess could think that immersion can not be measure and defined aka subjective. I do not agree with your statement "Content can add immersion. Immersion for immersion sake is not content", Content does not all ways add immersion for instance insta porting is content and yet creates no immersion. yet you are correct immersion is developed in a game through content so you can not have immersion without content; Immersion is a product of content, however content can have no immersion.

they don't need to be balanced, mechanics breed immersion. Like i said mechanics do not always breed immersion.

there is a communication breakdown here and I should've been more descriptive. yep i agree with that.

I'm taking the photograph of the earth with the hubble telescope. You're taking a photograph of the place you live. i do not agree with this and again maybe this was a result in a communication break down. I am advocating IMMERSION! in Final Fantasy 14 not the whole game, in this discussion. When i stated you are not looking at the big picture i meant you are disregarding a legitimate game mechanic (immersion) all together by stating it is a subjective mechanic.

You can't, you'll have losses. I'm okay with these losses as an open game will be conducive to more people's interests as they'll be able to access it more. Yes and when you open your self up for more interests you can shut everyone out at the same time. It is just not smart marketing to try and target every demographic and expect to even please half of each demographic thus resulting in profit, that is just not realistic. "We got a rushed product, not a half assed one." It was half assed because it was rushed, but even still how do you define rushed seeing as Hiromichi Tanaka had 5 years to develop the game.. and a previous game under his belt. When you target to many demographics you are more apt to create a sloppy product. Simple marketing strategy you play to your strengths and you develop a product that has a target demographic not all demographics...

Cite your sources. Then we'll talk. You'll have to show that your Immersion v. Spatial Presence is not an idea of your own and support it with outside sources in order to persuasively make me think that immersion can be objective. I also already read it when you posted it the first time. I just didn't buy it.

I also said that mechanics can be immersion, not necessarily that they always are. Pong can be immersive, the mechanic of a dot being bounced back and forth is the catalyst for the consumer's imagination. The level of immersion in Pong is defined by the player. They could choose to focus solely on the manipulation of their "paddle" to make sure the ball stays in play. They could choose to play defensively or offensively (taking immersion a step further). They could utilize a mixture of both in order to confuse their opponent (even further). They could even pretend the match was table tennis (even further). They could roleplay as their favorite pro tennis athlete (even further). The last is common in youth sports. In childhood pickup games before going in for a lay up or a jump shot from beyond the three point line the player may shout the name of their most admired professional athlete in an attempt to emulate them.

"Jordan!"

I've shown, and many other posters have already shown, how a person's level of immersion is primarily chosen not given. I suggest you read Konachibi's posts. They accurately show how immersion is subjective. Game mechanics act as the catalyst for immersion. Immersion for immersion's sake is considerably less immersive than if it were to involve player input as well.

[Konachibi]

and my axe!

And my bow.

Anyone getting deja vu? Sure I've heard this somewhere before...

[Azurymber]

Cite your sources. Then we'll talk.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brain < all sources cited
set + match