Why do the writers hate Foulques?

[Theodric]

Eorzea isn't a pleasant place. Discrimination and racism isn't uncommon - especially in the more xenophobic nations. I quite like it - though I've always been fond of gritty settings with morally complex characters. There's no need for fictional settings to mirror of modern day morality.

[ElHeggunte]

Eorzea isn't a pleasant place. Discrimination and racism isn't uncommon - especially in the more xenophobic nations. I quite like it - though I've always been fond of gritty settings with morally complex characters. There's no need for fictional settings to mirror of modern day morality.

This is what I was coming to say. I like how SE doesn't shy away from showing how ugly the world really is underneath the glossy, formal-looking exterior.

[Ayuhra]

This isn't so much a discussion about the Lancers being racist and that being an issue as it is about them (or their previous incarnation anyway) being racist and the game doesn't address it. It brushes against the topic but never quite goes there.

[Aralyne]

When I first started playing FFXIV, I had a friend who had been playing FFXIV for a while and she warned me that when levelling up my class, I'd have to do quests to acquire new skills and to advance in general.

Well, I can say I certainly did not expect the lancer quest to be so involved (story-wise) and that I, too, like some of you in this thread, would feel sympathetic towards Foulques who was supposed to be the "bad guy". I was so sympathetic towards him and felt so bad for him that after I had complete the final lancer quest and Foulques ended up dead, I rambled for ages to my friend about how unfair it was, that I didn't want him to die and that I hoped my dragoon job quests wouldn't be this depressing.... Fast forward several character levels and you fight bloody Estinien.. and I groaned and rolled my eyes and thought "Here we go again.. another character I'm interested in is about to die...".

Thankfully, Estinien doesn't die as we all know XD But you know? After the lancer quests, I just go into class and job quests now expecting someone to die at some given point and try not to get too attached to characters >_>

td;lr - yes I felt sorry for Foulques and felt that his story could have been written better. Poor guy deserved a second chance in my opinion.

[Bishop81]

A few things.

Firstly, many of the antagonists in FF14 have justifiable arguments for their actions Heavensward is full of them.

One could argue both Nidhogg and the Archbishop were justified in there actions. Humans did cruelly and brutally betray the Dragons and this is after what the Allag did to them. The Archbishop was leading a people effectively damned to endless war due to something they were not responable for themselves.

Yupe. Those are the best villains.

Even the Garleans ...

They truly believe, at least those lower on the hierarchy, they are doing what is best of the people of Eorzea. A manifest destiny of sorts.

[Alihabra]

Admittedly it was a while ago that I did the quests and I've forgotten a lot of the details, but I'm going to have to agree with OP here. I always felt kinda off about how he was treated. It always seemed like no one really cared about him at all. Ywain basically treats his issues with the same indifference as you treat an animal at the zoo - by pointing it out and saying "that's a tragic backstory. let's observe." I felt like if anyone showed him the slightest amount of empathy, the story may have had a bit more effect when he goes crazy and tries to kill us.

At the same time though I definitely can't condone his actions - the whole "cool motive, still murder" situation.

In the end I really can't support either side here. both have clearly done bad things, it just that the story only seems to label one side as explicitly "bad."

[SpiritMuse]

This isn't so much a discussion about the Lancers being racist and that being an issue as it is about them (or their previous incarnation anyway) being racist and the game doesn't address it. It brushes against the topic but never quite goes there.

Yeah I'm quite flummoxed by the complete lack of reaction to my characters Duskwightness everywhere I go. Most of the time I forget that Duskwights are supposed to be discriminated against, in Gridania at least.

In to he case of this story, I was disappointed more than anything else, really. Foulques was by far the most interesting character there. Especially being a fellow Duskwight I was really feeling sympathetic towards him and it seemed like he was working towards some sort of redemption in the end. But just when it seemed we were actually getting through to him he accidentally stepped off a cliff. And even then I thought maybe we'll get to him in time and be the hero and save him despite everything he's done to us and get through to him that way but no. He just died. I mean, I get not being able to save everyone but this was just... after all that, a random accidental death? Too anticlimactic.

By the way, that must be a sight, having Gale up against Foulques.

[Belhi]

I really want more of the history of Gridania to be expanded upon.

If the elementals are eternal as the dragons, then we can reason that they take any sort of violence towards them and theirs in the same way.

Essentially, the ancient peoples of the Twelveswood bargained with the Elementals to stay within the forest. After getting the list of strict rules that put keeping the forest in balance, a portion of the population refused to deal with them, and were driven into the caves. This is how the split between Wildwood and Duskwright happened to the Elezan, and essentially the root of all the racial tension.

On Gridanian history, we do know quite a bit. We know that it was during the 6th umbral era that the elementals turned on the five races. Prior to that the Amdipori lived in the Twelveswood. We sadly don't know the Amdipori's relations with the elementals. We know that they are nature spirits, closely tied to nature and see the world as spirits through the Aether. This makes their perspective somewhat hard for mortals to understand a lot of the time which can be why some of their decisions don't seem to have an obvious reason. Regardless, the Amdipori and the other nations involved in the War of the Magi abused magi to the point that it damaged the natural world angering the Elementals. The reached a point where it caused the manifestation of the Elementals anger and pain, a special type of elemental, to unleash a great flood which was the calamity that ended the 5th astral era.

In the wake of that the survivors who dwelled in twelveswood found that the natural world had turned hostile to them and they were force underground where the the nation of Gilmorra formed. The underground ruins in the Twelveswood are generally from that time, i.e. Tam Tara. After centuries people living in underground a group seeking to commune and find forgiveness from the elementals eventually managed to reach an understanding with the spirits and those living underground were finally allowed to live in the Forest as long as they respected the will of the elementals. I'm a bit vague on the details here but I think it was the Hyur who managed to make this deal with the elementals first since only hyur children are born as Padjal. Regardless it seems the Duskwight chose not to settle with the Wildwood Elezen and the Hyur.

Why this is the case isn't clear. We sadly know quite little on Gilmorra which probably would hold the origins of the racial divides. Its interesting cause you would imagine the three groups wouldn't have had a great deal of space to separate themselves so unless they settled separately you would think there would be some intermingling. Perhaps the issue the Duskwright had was that they stayed in the caves unwilling to trust the elementals. The elementals don't seem to hold treat the Duskwright notably different. Perhaps it could be as simple as the Duskwright leaders at the time being unwilling to follow Hyur leaders.

Maybe one day we will be able to journey into the ruins of Gilmorra and learn more. Alternatively maybe someone can ask Koji Fox the next time they do a lore Q&A.

[Tizzy_Tormentor]

I liked the Lancer questline because while Foulques is a tragic character, his hands aren't exactly clean, he did bad things due to the blatant racism of Duskwight, which made him more interesting, I do think just having him fall off a cliff and have everything he said brushed off was bs, since not even the guildmaster seems to acknowledge why he acted the way he did other than a meager "alas poor Foulques" I think redemption would have left a bigger impact, because honestly him committing suicide felt half-assed and ultimately solved nothing.

I loved the guy btw! I thought his trials were great.

"hey, having trouble with those wolves?"
*throws blindness bottle at me*
"there you go"

Foulques pls

[Kallera]

I would also like to point out that the (in)convienient part of MMORPG stories is that you can have characters attempt to join the system to "change it from within" then have absolutly nothing happen at all, well maybe a npc or two to say that the check is in the mail. Status Quo is the god of the citystates now, make of it what you will.