Astro in savage

[Arcana]

I hope you are prepared for an extremely heavy workload if you want to fix this job. I also encourage you to improve your testing protocol, because releasing a job in this state is not something that should ever happen.

I thought the same. I think SE AST designer did not a good job releasing the job in the actual state. Maybe he could be tested the job in Alexander Savage or check the global numbers vs the other healing class.

I am lvling whm right now because i think the AST rework it take several months that i dont want to wait. SE guys, take your time, do your tests but re-release a great healing-suport class again. The western and JP community will be happy ;3

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Keep in mind that getting a Bole is completely random. You would have to save the card in order to use it at the right time, in which case you already sacrifice enough. They could even reduce the buff to only last 10 seconds or increase the dmg cap to 20% of max HP. Either way, it would have a very situational use.

Collective Unconscious, again, I believe that the buff duration is key. Make it short (5-10s), with better potency. Because of completely limiting your actions/movement as well as your team's, it would only be useful in specific/transitional phases during a raid.

That is not the issue. Random or not, taking 10% or even 20% total hp in damage is basically a tank lb3. You would be able to pretty much ignore ultimates and tank busters - making healing checks in those parts absolutely trivial.

When designing an ability the first thing you need to ask yourself is: "are players going to exploit this to cheese through content?"

This being said, our AST will be switching to WHM for savage. We find the Oppressor too much of a hassle as SCH\AST. So yes, I am now convinced that current raid encounters design are not suited for AST and some tweaks are needed. But they need to be careful and not go overboard.

[Rajeme]

That is not the issue. Random or not, taking 10% or even 20% total hp in damage is basically a tank lb3. You would be able to pretty much ignore ultimates and tank busters - making healing checks in those parts absolutely trivial.

When designing an ability the first thing you need to ask yourself is: "are players going to exploit this to cheese through content?"

This being said, our AST will be switching to WHM for savage. We find the Oppressor too much of a hassle as SCH\AST. So yes, I am now convinced that current raid encounters design are not suited for AST and some tweaks are needed. But they need to be careful and not go overboard.

Well. RNG is a bigger issue than you think. No matter how powerful it is, without the right timing, even the most op skill is ineffective.

At most, you can only sort of control it in the preparation phrase. Once you got in the battle, you might not even have the chance to draw, let alone to start playing with RNG and setting up stuff. I lost count of how many times I couldn't draw the right card when I needed it already... I couldn't even get a single Ewer even after almost 10 minutes continuously drawing during a boss fight.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Well. RNG is a bigger issue than you think. No matter how powerful it is, without the right timing, even the most op skill is ineffective.

You mean like crit Adlo, the skill that every other healer would like to have, especially now that for some reason SCH itemizatio on gear is beyond retarded? Ok.

Also, CU is not rng.

[Lastelli]

You mean like crit Adlo, the skill that every other healer would like to have, especially now that for some reason SCH itemizatio on gear is beyond retarded? Ok.

Also, CU is not rng.

Crit adlo is the secondary effect of ONE skill. Cards are the characterizing factor of a job. It's a big difference. Crit adlo is not and never was necessary, but I agree it's nice to have a little more time to dps when it happens. Cards are necessary because if you take them away from an AST it just becomes a whm/sch with their most usefull skills removed from the hotbars...but it already is given how utterly useless cards are atm. CU is not RNG, true, it's just a terrible ability, let's just say Dissipation looks OP if you compare it to CU.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

Cards are necessary because if you take them away from an AST it just becomes a whm/sch with their most usefull skills removed from the hotbars...but it already is given how utterly useless cards are atm. CU is not RNG, true, it's just a terrible ability, let's just say Dissipation looks OP if you compare it to CU.

I think you should read the conversation from the start. I was commenting about bole and CU making so that the affected targets would not take more than 10% or 20% max hp in damage. If that happens, rng or not those things would be horribly broken.
Also just FYI Adlo costs more than 1k mp at 60. With current gear, if it does not crit it is an extremely mp inefficient heal. And SCH crit rate atm is horrendously low. That "secondary effect" is pretty damn important.

[Rajeme]

You mean like crit Adlo, the skill that every other healer would like to have, especially now that for some reason SCH itemizatio on gear is beyond retarded? Ok.

Also, CU is not rng.

Yeah. Except card system revolves and built around RNG so it's much bigger. Of course we have the option to throw away the card system so no more butthurt. Gears always change over time, easily. How about I suggest add "luck" as the new stat?

CU is unusable at the current stage. I can think of 2 things we can change: Make us moveable or make adjustments strong enough to the effect.

[Cynfael]

No, I meant to respond to you. The person you're going back and forth with never said anything different from you really. They weren't trying to say healers *shouldn't* DPS--only that they aren't expected to. Their wording was a bit unclear (perhaps from EAS), but they weren't saying what it seems you think they were saying.

What I was responding to was specifically the bit about not having to do more than what the role was "designed" for. Not much to misconstrue there. I simply indicated that Yoshi said nothing about that in his commentary on raid DPS.

[pandabearcat]

Hi all,

Not a healer, but a quick question about healer dps.

I remember there was a dev statement that while did not condemn healer dps, said that unless you are going for world firsts or undergeared, healer dps is not factored into any clears or dps requirements.

Please note I'm not asking about your opinion of healer dps (we know how much of a poopstorm that is), just the interpretation of the dev's remarks.

Now I ask this because a lot of people are needing healers to pull very good dps for stuff like Faust, and I'm wondering, is that against their philosophy? I assume that ~186-188 is the approximate maximum possible ilvl for most people right now (without esoterics or savage drops), so do the devs feel that is "undergeared" enough to require healer dps? Should people not clear A1S until they have esoteric farm one week later?

Or maybe our dps just aren't performing to as high as we want? Maybe dps need to pull 1500?

Just a bit of confusion on this front.

[Ghishlain]

Hi all,

Not a healer, but a quick question about healer dps.

I remember there was a dev statement that while did not condemn healer dps, said that unless you are going for world firsts or undergeared, healer dps is not factored into any clears or dps requirements.

Please note I'm not asking about your opinion of healer dps (we know how much of a poopstorm that is), just the interpretation of the dev's remarks.

Now I ask this because a lot of people are needing healers to pull very good dps for stuff like Faust, and I'm wondering, is that against their philosophy? I assume that ~186-188 is the approximate maximum possible ilvl for most people right now (without esoterics or savage drops), so do the devs feel that is "undergeared" enough to require healer dps? Should people not clear A1S until they have esoteric farm one week later?

Or maybe our dps just aren't performing to as high as we want? Maybe dps need to pull 1500?

Just a bit of confusion on this front.

The comment in question from Yoshi-P was with respect that they tune fights for specific ilvls and only take into account tank and DPS damage for that particular ilvl.

If you make the assumption that the baseline for A1S is i190 and the maximum ilvl achievable at this time is i186-i188, then yes, healer's will need to DPS to make up for the deficit that is unachievable due to lower than baseline ilvl.

Once your group hits that i190 mark, then Faust should be achievable without the addition of healer DPS.

[Edit] Just coming back to this a bit more after some more thought.

This means to me that, no, I do not think the dev's are going against their design philosophy. However, with that being said we don't know how tuned it is for that ilvl either. For example, it's now theoretically possible to get DPS from 0 to 1300 depending on your skill and job. If S-E tuned it for a higher end of the skill level spectrum, the obviously the overall DPS check would be increased to suit.

i.e.
If the "average" DPS can do on average 800 DPS, then damage check for DPS for the "average" would be tuned to 3,200.
If the "skilled" DPS can do on average 1,200 DPS, then the damage check for DPS for the "skilled" would be to 4,800.

In some respects, it feels like they tuned the actual DPS for Savage to be higher than average, thus we see the many people hitting the brick wall known as Faust at the current ilvl.