How would you feel if they scrapped the current "classes"?

[Kimahri]

Okay, Gifthorse. I'm going to stop at your first paragraph. If the first paragraph is filled with your stupidity then I will not read the rest. Do me a favor, you idiot, and look back up above that sentence where it's talking about groups performing their specific role.....Remember these three words, mongrol. "Their Specific Role." Got it so far, Spanky? Now go all the way back up to the very first bolded letters.....Here is the sentence again, just in case. "In Final Fantasy XIV, the Armoury System is how players and characters will be able to change their current class or role." Do you see where it says "Class OR Roll?" Yeah. Seems you again decided to skip that part, Goofy. When they say current class, they also mean it's current role.

Now tell me something, Gifthorse. How are you that dense? You're basically saying to me that you're right no matter what, and hell the Pope is Jewish too. Now do me a favor and stop posting because I'm tired of having to deal with people such as yourself.

[gifthorse]

Okay, Gifthorse. I'm going to stop at your first paragraph. If the first paragraph is filled with your stupidity then I will not read the rest. Do me a favor, you idiot, and look back up above that sentence where it's talking about groups performing their specific role.....Remember these three words, mongrol. "Their Specific Role." Got it so far, Spanky? Now go all the way back up to the very first bolded letters.....Here is the sentence again, just in case. "In Final Fantasy XIV, the Armoury System is how players and characters will be able to change their current class or role." Do you see where it says "Class OR Roll?" Yeah. Seems you again decided to skip that part, Goofy. When they say current class, they also mean it's current role.

Now tell me something, Gifthorse. How are you that dense? You're basically saying to me that you're right no matter what, and hell the Pope is Jewish too. Now do me a favor and stop posting because I'm tired of having to deal with people such as yourself.

I think you've gone insane...

I don't know why you're holding that article up as though it's something we all have to answer to. But anyways, I think what they're trying to say is that you can change your class, and also switch roles too. Someone earlier mentioned how they can change class to gladiator, but also change their roles between tank and damage dealer. I'm pretty sure that's what the article is referring to. You can change both class, by switching weapons, or role, by switching up abilities.

But you should go back and read my whole post because you obviously need to. But I'm not surprised you didn't read it, you never read any of my posts. If your responses to them are anything to go by, that is.

[darkstarpoet1]

doesn't or mean they are different? it's like saying your thm is your class but is your role a nuker, debuffer, or healer

[Kimahri]

Holy Hell! You know what, I take it back. I will respond back to your whole thread. You want to know why I have to ignore your points of view? It's because the first time I heard it I told you why it doesn't work. I do believe others said the exact same thing to you, but hell you chose to ignore them as well. So why are you stating the same garble over and over again?

I'm looking through your post and you keep using class and role as two different theories all together. Well I'd hate to burst your bubble, but I think the post above this just cleared that mess up......Actually, that would be the third post since the third time is the charm for you. Class and Role are exactly the same thing.

Now your post regarding that there are no jobs in FFXIV....Well that's a fact......Because they're called Classes now, Dopey! Classes are also called Roles! Just think I better keep it in here at least five times a post now so it sinks in, Alabama Pete. Advanced classes do not need to be integrated into a game that hasn't formed it's own spine yet.

Now.....When you talk about a class specializing as a blm......I hope to God you're talking about a DoM class......It would seem stupid that you could specialize as a blm in a DoW class. And again no class, or role, should have all the abilities of the other classes. That's just stupid. "Look, mom. I'm a blm with a shield and I just used protect three, berserk, and holy avenger on myself!" (Hint I'm not really using proper XIV terms.) I still do not see how this makes the blm, "Special" if it's using everyone elses abilities.

And hey....What about the basic classes? Do you mean to tell me that SE should just have them there just for the sole fact that you have to level them without actually WANTING to use them? Just something you HAVE to do to give that BLM it's abilities from everything? And if I pick the ability cure, what ability is getting nerfed? Something you don't want to use? Something that doesn't matter in the first place?

I'm not ignoring your posts, Dumbo the Elephant. I'm posting comments about how your idea's would work. Why don't you do me a favor and scroll back some and try and enlighten me on some of my threads over making the classes, or roles, unique? Point out some flaws with at least some form of logic so I can scratch those idea's out to make new ones? Seems like I've been trying to point out the flaws in your system, but YOU ignore it and re-post it every five other posts. Just zip it, Donald. Your theories are questionable at best, and you can't fully understand them unless you read it three times over.

P.S. Don't worry, Gifthorse. I'm not angry over you or anybody else. I'm just stupified over the lack of intellect when it comes to discussing idea's and potential merges of opinions. It seems you want it either your way or the highway. Some things I agree with you on, others I don't. So it's not me who ignores you, it's you who ignores anyone who disagree's with you.

[gifthorse]

You'll never understand.

[Kimahri]

I think you've gone insane...

I don't know why you're holding that article up as though it's something we all have to answer to. But anyways, I think what they're trying to say is that you can change your class, and also switch roles too. Someone earlier mentioned how they can change class to gladiator, but also change their roles between tank and damage dealer. I'm pretty sure that's what the article is referring to. You can change both class, by switching weapons, or role, by switching up abilities.

But you should go back and read my whole post because you obviously need to. But I'm not surprised you didn't read it, you never read any of my posts. If your responses to them are anything to go by, that is.

Psst. Look up above this post....I think you'll notice I did write about your whole post.....And, um......Yeah....There you go again reading something and thinking they meant something different. If they didn't want to compare the two as the same, they would've said different statements about the two. Even so. If your role is tank, wouldn't you automatically assume their talking about the Gladiator class?

You know what's so funny is that I can say whatever I want with any facts I lay at your feet, and you'll basically try to switch them around in your favor. Now. I will go ahead and show you what I mean by what they would've done if they meant that class and role were two different things. "In Final Fantasy XIV, the Armoury System is how players and characters will be able to change their current class, or assume a different role in the group." Did they say this though? Nope.

Oh I think I'm done now. Maybe instead of just making an argument out of this I'll do the exact same thing you do.....Say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over.........and over!


Edit: And look at that! Another post from you with absolutely no points of counter defense to your theory with a rationalized approach! Thank you again, Gifthorse, for proving my point once more!

[Lamhirh]

Khimari. If someone think different than you its no valid point to insult them. Role is not somethig your class forces you do. Want to be tank, than oput all your points in vit, take tanking skils from all of the classes ( or more - specialisations ) and you have your role.

for damage dealing, I mainly play as archer. For solo i very like to use bloodbath skill ( maruder) and few lancer skills.

I the whole i feel the current system needs some tweaking, but is awesome. In particular cures myh need for having 5 gazillion alts to play all aspects of game. Now I only need to carry gazillion weapons and armors in mybackpack to switch at will.

[gifthorse]

Psst. Look up above this post....I think you'll notice I did write about your whole post.....And, um......Yeah....There you go again reading something and thinking they meant something different. If they didn't want to compare the two as the same, they would've said different statements about the two. Even so. If your role is tank, wouldn't you automatically assume their talking about the Gladiator class?

You know what's so funny is that I can say whatever I want with any facts I lay at your feet, and you'll basically try to switch them around in your favor. Now. I will go ahead and show you what I mean by what they would've done if they meant that class and role were two different things. "In Final Fantasy XIV, the Armoury System is how players and characters will be able to change their current class, or assume a different role in the group." Did they say this though? Nope.

Oh I think I'm done now. Maybe instead of just making an argument out of this I'll do the exact same thing you do.....Say the same thing over and over and over and over and over and over.........and over!


Edit: And look at that! Another post from you with absolutely no points of counter defense to your theory with a rationalized approach! Thank you again, Gifthorse, for proving my point once more!

Well the only reason I have to say things over and over is because it obviously doesn't sink in the first time. Regardless of how you want to read into that article, which for some reason you believe holds any weight in this discussion, the fact remains that most of us consider the armory system to be a way for us to build our own jobs.

We consider the armory system as a pool of skills and abilities from which we are able to define our own roles. We make a distinction between class and role for the reason that a class is the building blocks for players to build their own role.

The crux of this debate has nothing to do with how I interpret that article, but instead what you believe about the class/role debate. You don't form a distinction whereas I do.

It's a simple argument of definitions. And until you realise that, I stand by my previous statement that you will never understand.

Look, I even had to spell that out for you too.

[darkstarpoet1]

i have to agree with lamhirh and gifthorse here. in our nm battles we usually have multiple thm and con in the party but they have their own distinct role the same as the gla's. we usually have a thm for debuffs a thm for nuking in br's and one healing. that's one class but it has 3 different roles. we have a con healing and usually another thm that is buffing the party and healing in between. those are roles they play from within their classes. my role is a 50 pug that deals damage and since i have resurrect because i have leveled my thm up also i resurrect my allies that are on the front line since it's easier to take me out of the battle for a few seconds to get my fallen ally up than it is to bring a mage close enough to die. that is my role in the party. my class is pug but my role is different in the battle. we also have one gladiator that is main tank so has abilities set to tank while the other uses incap moves. that is just a few things i see when i see roles in the party. just because you have a class does not mean you will always fill the same role inside the party.

i am not trying to start an argument, but just sayin that just because we are a certain class does not make our roles set in a given situation.

[Abraxai]

For me it's not even necessarily scrapping the current classes.. For me it's about tightening down on the class customizability.. It's too vast that it doesn't really matter outside of weapon what class you play. I've seen Thaumaturges tank, I've seen Gladiator's DD.. I think it's too vast.. I could be wrong, but I'm a FFXI-hugger.. I'd settle instantly for FFXI-2 so I think I'm biased