How would you feel if they scrapped the current "classes"?

[darkstarpoet1]

Now I see what you're saying. I'm not going to start an argument with you, just show you a point or two. What you're saying about what a THM does with nuking and debuffing I have absolutely no problem about it what so ever. Since it's only one of two mage classes, I don't mind a limit to the cure. Sacrifice is basically all Thaumaturge needs. I don't see why it would also need a Conjurer's cure if it has one of it's own? Things along this line I'm in total support for.

What I don't agree with is the fact that people can pick and choose from all the abilities to settle into their custom class. I've seen a damn Thaumaturge solo a hard NM without near the difficulty it took Avesta in XI to kill Genbu. It took Avesta 2 hours to kill that damn thing.....What I'm trying to say is that if there are no restrictions to the abilities being used by every class, then down the line it'll come accustomed to make a near-perfect class. Even if you use Gifthorse's "Nerf ability" concept, people will still choose the best abilities out of the pack.

My concept was in line with a few others in this thread. Make the access of certain abilities to be class specific. I'm not saying all abilities. You can still use abilities like ferocity and that Marauder ability that lets you syphon HP with the next attack. I don't agree that your pugilist can use raise. That's one ability that'll cripple the Conjurer. (It is Conjurer, right? lol) Right now it basically feels to me that if I'm playing Pugilist, I'm also playing Marauder/Lancer/Gladiator. And in your case, Conjurer. I can't say Archer, because that class has a bow. lol

well technically resurrect and it's a thm ability, but i do see your point. my point is my pug has magic and i learned a magic ability after spending a month leveling my thm so why should i not be able to use it. i use it as an addition to assist my mage not criple it and am used in a party in that role. a mage doesn't need to get close to a nm with big aoe attacks, but my 50 pug that has the ability can. i just feel the the learned abilities should be able to be used by your other classes because you took the time to learn them. i feel that classes would become more unique if they gave more of the abilities through the guilds that you could purchase as class specific abilities. then you could get the higher level abilities to use on only that class. i just don't see how if i have a 40 thm and a 50 pug i am crippling the thm class. i took the time to level it and play as both classes in nm battles depending on what is needed from me. i wasn't tryin to argue with you just showing that whether or not you agree with my play style or not it is how the game was made.

if you really want to watch the thm solo the nm pay attention it uses almost all thm abilities not other classes. the reason it does it is because emulate is a way overpowered move. if you take the elemental resistance from a mob and put it on yourself the mage takes less than 1/4 the damage a main tanking gladiator does. then it can use another move shadowseer and do massive damage to the nm. the thm is overpowered as bad as the arc is imo, but that is for se to do something about nerfing them it's not cross class abilities causing it. have you seen a pug/arc/gla/lnc solo a nm even though it can use most of the abilities? that class is just overpowered and people found the glitch to make it massive and se will get it fixed.

[Abraxai]

For me it's not even necessarily scrapping the current classes.. For me it's about tightening down on the class customizability.. It's too vast that it doesn't really matter outside of weapon what class you play. I've seen Thaumaturges tank, I've seen Gladiator's DD.. I think it's too vast.. I could be wrong, but I'm a FFXI-hugger.. I'd settle instantly for FFXI-2 so I think I'm biased

[gifthorse]

For me it's not even necessarily scrapping the current classes.. For me it's about tightening down on the class customizability.. It's too vast that it doesn't really matter outside of weapon what class you play. I've seen Thaumaturges tank, I've seen Gladiator's DD.. I think it's too vast.. I could be wrong, but I'm a FFXI-hugger.. I'd settle instantly for FFXI-2 so I think I'm biased

A mage tank would be so cool. It could cast protective walls and position itself in front of players to protect them, like in the R46 cutscene.

Anyways, I don't think the issue is customizability, it's more that the roles people opt to play need to be officialised by SE in some way. I think that's why they are bringing back classic class names. One reason is because people call for class uniqueness, but it's also a way for us to cement our roles more firmly.

[darkstarpoet1]

For me it's not even necessarily scrapping the current classes.. For me it's about tightening down on the class customizability.. It's too vast that it doesn't really matter outside of weapon what class you play. I've seen Thaumaturges tank, I've seen Gladiator's DD.. I think it's too vast.. I could be wrong, but I'm a FFXI-hugger.. I'd settle instantly for FFXI-2 so I think I'm biased

i say it's an easy fix. give more items in the guilds such as luminous spire for gladiator that you can only get by using gladiator guild marks in the gladiator guild and can only be used by the gladiator. it would give each class more uniqueness by allowing people to purchase higher level abilities only their main class can use. this allows people to pend the hrs leveling another class for its abilities to stick on their main/favorite class without taking away from the uniqueness of the class that basic learned ability came from. can you really tell me if i learned to cast cure on myself that if i grabbed a sword i would forget how to do it even though i still have magic in me? if i learned a special punch and i had a bow in my hand i would still have the ability to punch something. now if it is something from the guild itself they all want you in "their guild only" so then it would mean those abilities should only be used on those classes.

[Lamhirh]

Well there is other way. If you want bonus skills or bonus efficiency in soe skills, you sign for guild, and you can be only actibe in ONE guild at time. you still use current system, but all skills from current guikld are enhanced/easier to equip( less points cost) (or maybe skills from different guilds costs more to equip?) Yes it would require you to run to city, find the guild and do short conversatioj for that, but how diferent would be it from trunning to moghouse and equiping job and sub?

[gifthorse]

Well there is other way. If you want bonus skills or bonus efficiency in soe skills, you sign for guild, and you can be only actibe in ONE guild at time. you still use current system, but all skills from current guikld are enhanced/easier to equip( less points cost) (or maybe skills from different guilds costs more to equip?) Yes it would require you to run to city, find the guild and do short conversatioj for that, but how diferent would be it from trunning to moghouse and equiping job and sub?

Well there are way more flexible ways of achieving the same thing.

Like, for example, just choosing something from your UI that indicates what role you want to be.

[Kimahri]

i say it's an easy fix. give more items in the guilds such as luminous spire for gladiator that you can only get by using gladiator guild marks in the gladiator guild and can only be used by the gladiator. it would give each class more uniqueness by allowing people to purchase higher level abilities only their main class can use. this allows people to pend the hrs leveling another class for its abilities to stick on their main/favorite class without taking away from the uniqueness of the class that basic learned ability came from. can you really tell me if i learned to cast cure on myself that if i grabbed a sword i would forget how to do it even though i still have magic in me? if i learned a special punch and i had a bow in my hand i would still have the ability to punch something. now if it is something from the guild itself they all want you in "their guild only" so then it would mean those abilities should only be used on those classes.

I also agree to this one that using guild marks to purchase abilities would go a long way to making the class more unique. I also think another way is to set the weaponskills as the class only being able to use them. Don't agree with a Lancer using Arrow Helix from an Archer.

[Lamhirh]

Well thing s you hadnt seen thaumture tnk and glad DD, you saw a tanking magic user, and a DDing sword/shield user.Or even more a tanking ddisciple of Maging , and sword using disciple of War DDing. the classes are more like weapon skills. and role is what we want to do with them. I agree the system needs to be tweaked. there are lots of good ideas ( a roles, equipable in same way as classes, so for example if you equipp class maruder, and role tank, you will be tanking axe user, and so on) class bonuses to certain roles ( magic clases would have 20% bonus to magic efficiency, etc) or tying classic jbs to clothing, so like you equip certain armor and certain weapon to make combo, or many other ideas. But point is this is FFXIV not FFXI-2. Current system is amazing step forward to ditch the boring old DnD class chains. However there is a big group of people who never wereable to build something new with lego, all they could do was build things that were in the set manual. For those people having this system is crtainly confusing and overhelming. So there is cure: Presets. Either user defined, and predefined.

[Lamhirh]

its effort versus reward. If yuo dont want to put some effort, yuo ont get reward. clean and simple. Your point is, from what i see, yuo saw THM soloing NM you cant, so instead of thinking what i should do to do same with my favourite class/skillset, you want to destroy the current system , so he cant do it anymore.

I know its from other game... but kind of goes well with this discussion

http://www.willyteecomics.com/images...s/howwiiol.swf

[Kimahri]

its effort versus reward. If yuo dont want to put some effort, yuo ont get reward. clean and simple. Your point is, from what i see, yuo saw THM soloing NM you cant, so instead of thinking what i should do to do same with my favourite class/skillset, you want to destroy the current system , so he cant do it anymore.

I know its from other game... but kind of goes well with this discussion

http://www.willyteecomics.com/images...s/howwiiol.swf

No. This is not a category of Effort vs. Reward. There are people who cannot put in the amount of time that others can. Other people have jobs, you know. Other people that have far more important matters to attend to, such as children/school/chores/job. A lot of people are recreational gamers. You're basically telling them the same concept as your telling me. "Oh well boo-hoo that you can't play as much as me." or "Well it's your fault you don't want to play as much as me."

This current trend is rather dull and pointless for everyone to enjoy. Seems like only the people who can put hours upon hours into this game really like it.