Please help me understand why i should continue to play a repeat of 2.0?

[Kallera]

*nods*

Interesting that you list Castlevania as an RPG though. Tell me which titles of Castlevania have you played and enjoyed?

He might mean the igavanias (SOTN, OOE, Harmony of Despair, etc.)

Even they had some measure of vertical progress. True horizontal progress would end up affecting the need to explore and find more powerful items. It was far more interesting facing a boss with new stuff instead of playing richer mode and "Hydro Storm!" Ing everything to death.

Or to take a page from Harmony. Floating Soma with Valmanways. You practically won the game the instant you had this overpowered monstrosity of a build. Takes a lot of the teeth right out of a fight, and the game, for other players once you had two or three soma with em.

And no matter what additions there were, unless it was a Valmanways +1 soma players wouldn't touch it. Seems like a waste, right? And it poisoned everything those blades touched.

[Hyrist]

He might mean the igavanias (SOTN, OOE, Harmony of Despair, etc.)

Even they had some measure of vertical progress. True horizontal progress would end up affecting the need to explore and find more powerful items.

Thank, you, but I'd rather he speak for himself. We are, after all, trying to address his desires in this thread, and how some measure of them or general enjoyment can be gleaned from the game as it is now. I'd rather not tip my hand as to how, until I've reached my conversational point. It's better that he reaches it with me, than just to lay it all out in front of him -as in forums, it tends to come out as badgering.

[Thandronen]

Played FFXI for a long time and thoroughly enjoyed it but it had its issues, which folks here can feel free to go on at length about. Been playing FFXIV since 2.0 beta and thoroughly enjoy it, though it too is not without its flaws. For starters, XIV could use a couple of coil-esque quality challenging 24-man raids that Free Companies could instance and do together as a group. Besides that and a few other minor tweaks the game could use, this is still a very solid MMO.

If you're not finding yourself enjoying it in its current state, this might not be the game for you. It will never be a FFXI-clone and no amount of expansions are going to get it there or even close, no matter how much former XI players long for it to be.

[SkizzleofRagnarok]

Hyrist: almost all versions of castlevania from nes to xbox/ps3 versions to the 3ds ones. Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched). Anyways enough of that negativity. I've made my point we are not going anywhere with this discussion it will come to do Yoshi P fanboys vs FFXI dreamers.

[DreadRabbit]

Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched).

...Hyrist asked you what games you played, then you yourself listed Castlevania as an RPG. Not exactly hard for people to get confused by what you mean when you keep contradicting yourself in your posts o_O

[Hyrist]

Hyrist: almost all versions of castlevania from nes to xbox/ps3 versions to the 3ds ones. Its an adventure game for me and not a rpg so i still don't understand why people yet again intentionally pick on minor things such eeemergad he thinks castlevania is an a rpgs (almost sounds that far fetched). Anyways enough of that negativity. I've made my point we are not going anywhere with this discussion it will come to do Yoshi P fanboys vs FFXI dreamers.

I meant no offense. Castlevania stretches a wide breath of genres, but always seems to prefer to refer to itself as an action adventure - and not an RPG. So I was courious as to the games and elements that lead you to add it into the RPG genre. I was not judging you. I'm glad for the clarifcation.

This said, I focused on Castlevania not for the fact that it was different from the Genre you were talking about, but rather because it holds elements I wanted to talk to you about. Specificly the fact that many of the Castlevania games are actually quite similar in nature. In fact, several of the Classic Castlevania games, (I, III, IV, Bloodlines, Dracula X (and Chronicles) etc.) are actually very close permutations of one another. Yet, you list them as some of the games you remember fondly, yes?

This is because there is no contrast of expectation, you expected more of the same from these games. But, when they did change, you still played them and enjoyed them.

Heavensward is much the same as its predecessor, because it seeks to refine on its successes, rather than make a radical deviation from its previous iteration. It seeks refinement, rather than revolution.

As far as your concern in difficulty, remember that in some of the Castlevania games, there were 'Hardmode' versions of those games? The loot pool between it and the others were identical. I ask you, honestly, did you feel your achievement in beating the games on Hard Mode feel cheapened by those who acquired items in Normal?

What I would ask of you, for your own enjoyment, is to approach the game as an Action-Adventure game, like Castlevania. Yes, it has Roleplay Elements, yes, it has multiplayer elements. Technically it is an MMORPG, but it plays very much like an action-adventure game with RPG elements.

I feel we place too much expectation on 'Genre's' these days that we forget ourselves and the elements that are similar in other genre's that we find fun. FFXI and other MMOs, they are their own games. I don't try to compare them. That's with FFXI being my first and most played MMORPG. That's as a Legacy member.

Skizzle, I do hope you find enjoyment in the game again. My best advice is to approach it with a clean slate, devoid of expectation, with the same awaited joy you would a Castlevania title. Don't worry about the achievements of others - they're not a part of your game, any different than someone who plays a console title on their own elsewhere. Focus on your own achievements, at your own pace, and the time you get to spend with those you care about and who's company you enjoy in the game.

And always remember, you can beat the game on Hardmode while others are struggling with normal. That's where you can feel accomplished.

Anyways, hope you stick with it. Don't get discouraged, this is just a game, like any other. There's no need to treat it any more special then the library of single-player games behind you.

[Zarzak]

As opposed to what MMO? This is what every modern MMO has devolved into.

[Tadacho]

Skizzle isn't asking for the game to be overhauled, he's commenting on the fact that the types of battle content (both current and planned) is an identical pattern to 2.0, rather than mixing it up and adding a new battle system or two. And rightly so. Is it too much to ask for a new type of PvE in an expansion?

Personally, I'm most disappointed they've rehashed the hunt system, because it was awful in 2.0 and it's awful now.

[Aeyis]

Because it's successful. If you do any research on the topic, the model used by FFXIV has been consistently the most successful model of gameplay.

It's succesful for making money. But not for providing a quality game.

Wow was a much better game before it came to be the great moneymaking machine it is for blizzard today.


Making a game accessible for the average joe brings in a lot of subscriptions. And via those a lot of money.

But the average joe is not a gamer. They dont invest much time or effort into the game. (why would they, when they can go out instead? Its just a game!) Nor do they care much about the quality of the game (since its just to pass a few hours, much like a cheap movie).

However, while this makes the game economical succesful... because of the reduction in quality (the time and effort the game requires from a player) the game itself suffers.



Yes the model is succesful..for SE. But for us, the players that care about playing a good game? Can we really say its a good model?


I have seen the effects this model had in wow over the past years: The game became increasingly dull and uninteresting to play. Because everything that took a little bit of time or investment was deemed ''too hard to get into for the average joe''.

[Cirgellon]

Skizzle isn't asking for the game to be overhauled, he's commenting on the fact that the types of battle content (both current and planned) is an identical pattern to 2.0, rather than mixing it up and adding some new battle systems as most expansion packs for most MMOs usually do. And rightly so. Is it too much to ask for a new type of PvE in an expansion?

I've only played a few MMOs, but every one of them died shortly after changing their end game to something new, usually while also making drastic changes to classes. We don't put so many hours into this game because we want a different game. They don't have an unlimited budget. If they start making alternatives to raids and dungeons, development resources will get pulled from other areas.

If you want a different game, try different games. This game is clearly doing something right as it's extremely successful.

The proression that he doesn't like is exactly what makes this game what it is.

The OP still has yet to claim he likes anything about this game. Again, for the 10th time, you are doing it wrong if you need to ask why you should play a game. The answer to that question will always be: You shouldn't continue playing the game. You should find a game that you like. You can then come back to this game after a break and see if it's fun again. If it isn't, oh well. It's a video game.