Buff Bards or Riot

[Waeksyn]

Now that I've played the job at 60 for a few days, it's clear to me that Bard has definitely been nerfed and needs to be tweaked back into parity with the other DPS classes. The loss of mobility is not so bad - i can get used to the nerf on my movement (I turn off WM for really movement intensive engagements). It's the dmg nerf that is so depressing. What makes this doubly depressing is that this dmg nerf is NOT offset by any new party support value at all.

This could be fixed in a few ways. The dmg increase under WM could be raised to 30%. Recast on barrage (while under WM) could be reduced from 45 sec to 30 and the recast on Emp Arrow and Sidewinder also reduced. They could also remove the loss of damage while singing Ballad or Army's Paeon while under WM.

Reducing recast on barrage would be my vote.

[Alberel]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...hould-be-lower

The simple fact that parties were stacking bards to rotate their songs back in 2.0 shows that the nerfs to BRD were very much needed. Other jobs have utility, yes, but none as incredibly potent as BRD and MCH have. You can argue about it as much as you like but it doesn't change the facts; we've not seen parties stacking other jobs for their utility as we saw with BRDs.

Do BRDs and MCHs need some attention and buffs? Yes. But don't ever expect them to be returned to the level of the likes of SMN and BLM as SE is well aware that parties would start stacking BRDs and MCHs again if they dealt competitive DPS whilst giving the rest of the party infinite resources.

[Felessan]

The simple fact that parties were stacking bards to rotate their songs back in 2.0 shows that the nerfs to BRD were very much needed. Other jobs have utility, yes, but none as incredibly potent as BRD and MCH have. You can argue about it as much as you like but it doesn't change the facts; we've not seen parties stacking other jobs for their utility as we saw with BRDs.

A lot of things happened since 2.0.
SE keep lessen a need to rely on bard's songs, it's understandable that they want to change situation that bard have fixed spot in group. But they add nothing to bards themselves in return. Good healers don't need ballad if they do not die, TP issue greatly reduced with all "phase combat" and fixes and NIN can cover in some situation. This means that bard utility quickly becomes obsolete and their presence in party (with their equal to tank(!) damage) is not justified.

Let's look at currently available encounters - Bismark Ex and Ravanna EX. You don't need neither ballad nor paeon on both. So bard is just taking place of someone who can pull significantly higher dps adding nothing to a party.

[KyteStones]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me. You'd never see an archer do that (fantasy game or not). I think this is a good thing having your asses planted to the ground in order to fire your arrows efficiently instead of jumping around like you're all on PCP. If you don't like the move, don't use it.

You think I use all of my BLM spells? Like I cast freeze ever anymore. Oh wait, Lethargy? Useful on the slime in Syracus Tower and that's only to delay the slime long enough to kill. Apocostacsis? Yeah... MAYBE used once. It doesn't do that much for me to worry about.

I have plenty of moves that are useless and that I don't use. So where are my massive complaint threads about removing these useless skills and replacing them with more useful ones? Oh wait...there are none! Why? Because we learn to adapt to the class and make it better with out those useless moves.

[Dante_V]

The damage output I've seen with WM on vs Off is like 100+ dps for those who seem to be doing it right. It sounds like it is working as intended.

To the guy talking about it not doing a lot of damage at level 52, it's not supposed to. The other skills you get will compliment it later.

I'd just be happy you didn't end up like machinist. =0

[Felessan]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me. You'd never see an archer do that (fantasy game or not). I think this is a good thing having your asses planted to the ground in order to fire your arrows efficiently instead of jumping around like you're all on PCP. If you don't like the move, don't use it.

Personally I don't min change in playstyle. But it just doesn't really add anything, it makes things harder and still bards do the same damage as before. And this damage is way below reasonable even for "semi-support" dps.

[Mimiru_S]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me.

On behalf of all Bards, I'd like to apologize for ruining your game and to let you know we will try our hardest to change, for your enjoyment.

[KyteStones]

Personally I don't min change in playstyle. But it just doesn't really add anything, it makes things harder and still bards do the same damage as before. And this damage is way below reasonable even for "semi-support" dps.

too many times (especially on titan ex *shudder*) have I seen bards jumping around firing their moves and getting demolished by AOE. This is a good change. Also, from bards I've played with at 60, their DPS is incredible so it sounds like to me, that people are just playing the class wrong with how it is now designed to work. With the whole "i jumped out of that" or "my attack turned me around in mid air and screwed me up" arrogance.

[Lemuria]

Here's the problem with these threads..you people (bards) are always jumping around running around shooting your arrows and never sitting still. This annoys me. You'd never see an archer do that (fantasy game or not)

Armies aside, many individual archers were significantly more mobile than you might think. There are historical records of archers who wielded arrows in their bow hand so they could fire them more quickly, as well as many with quivers set to the side to make them easier, and faster to draw. There are also countless tales of archers who could loose 3 arrows in mere seconds.

I have plenty of moves that are useless and that I don't use. So where are my massive complaint threads about removing these useless skills and replacing them with more useful ones? Oh wait...there are none! Why? Because we learn to adapt to the class and make it better with out those useless moves.

Actually, those exist. There have been plenty of people complaining about the rubbish BLM skills, because let's face it most of the BLM unique skills suck up to 50. That you haven't seen these threads says you simply haven't been looking or have seen it and are ignoring it to suit your arguments.

Back on topic however, none of this changes the fact that WM simply isn't that great. What we gain in weaponskill damage we lose in auto attack damage. It's only real use is for Empyreal Arrow and Sidewinder, our new strongest attacks. One of which on a 60s timer no less. Is this a good trade for losing mobility? Not really, no. And the instant we put up any other songs we effectively lose the benefits of our Wanderer's Minuet anyway.

[Mimiru_S]

Armies aside, many individual archers were significantly more mobile than you might think. There are historical records of archers who wielded arrows in their bow hand so they could fire them more quickly, as well as many with quivers set to the side to make them easier, and faster to draw. There are also countless tales of archers who could loose 3 arrows in mere seconds.

Not to mention archers on horseback.