DPS display could easily be solved with a system already in game.

[Sebazy]

In all the hours, pugs, DFs, PFs, roulettes, sales groups, carry groups, friends groups, random 1am drunk runs and whatnot. I've *NEVER* yet once seen anyone asked to leave a party because of what a parser says. I've seen comments about people doing blatantly silly things (we're talking SMNs not using dots, BLMs only casting blizzard here) that you don't need a parser to realise that something is wrong but still, I've never seen someone removed over a group because of it. And it's not for want of experience, I suspect I helped carry half the level 50 community through Titan HM in 2.0 and likely sold it to a good portion of the rest.

The only time I've ever seen DPS be raised as an issue is within unabashed hardcore progression team raiding to strict attendance and performance targets.

And yet everytime this parser thing comes up on the OF. These threads would have you believe that it happens in every other PF farm team. I just don't see it quite frankly.

I do feel that the communities distaste for this sort of thing would make adding this kind of instance parse a bad thing overall though. Given this game's DPS checks in raid content, SE should implement the ability to self parse on dummies however. That is just inexcusable and lazy on SE's part.

[Steady]

But the bad people might talk bad about me.

There is no compromise here. All you have is a bunch of people who haven't touched progression raid content complaining that they don't want parsers touching their daily experts. That's all it will ever be by the way things are going.

oh, it's you again.

I'm still not sure how threads like these still exist. The last one I made in favor of parsers got me blocked from forums for a week for suggesting it.

In any case. The only content that needs parsed is that which it's difficult to clear without large amounts of DPS. No one cares what you parse for 90% of the content. Slow dungeons are just a risk of randomly queuing. But if you are doing current End Game content, you should care about your DPS when compared to others. If you don't you shouldn't be doing that content.

[Natashio]

Here's a few guides..

Black Mage: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...age-Calculator

Dragoon: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...age-Calculator

Monk: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...-Temple-Reborn

Summoner: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...Summoner-Guide

I couldn't find ninja's or bard's... I didn't feel like searching.

It's not rocket science. The bigger the numbers on the main and important secondary stats ultimately determine what the damage out is going to be. Parsers for a vertical progression game . I don't see the point. I never have. I also don't care if people use them. You do whatever you want.

[Massterchef]

That question was purely rhetorical, thank you very much.

The fact that it's even a question, rhetoric or not, would suggest there is a double standard. Because kicking someone for their inability to perform their role beit tanking or healing is rarely questioned.

[Eidolon]

It's not rocket science. The bigger the numbers on the main and important secondary stats ultimately determine what the damage out is going to be. Parsers for a vertical progression game . I don't see the point. I never have. I also don't care if people use them. You do whatever you want.

Using someone's gear as a measure of their DPS is a very inaccurate measurement.

Rotation is the biggest thing in this game. You can have full i130, and if all you do is press 1-2-3, you will not do as much DPS as someone in i110 doing their proper rotation. If you assume all things are equal, then yes, you are right - the one with the better gear will indeed do better DPS. But to think that it's the ONLY thing that matters "In a vertical progression game" is just... well. Wrong. =/


The next biggest thing, is uptime. Have you ever noticed the difference between a BLM who skiis their casts, versus a Black Mage who "Runs to the location to handle a mechanic"? Yes, both dodged /reacted properly. But the one who skiis will ultimately do more DPS, because of the ABC's of casting.

How about Melee on T13, during Phase 1? A DPS that knows how to step in/step out when not covered for earthshakers will do more DPS than one who runs all the way to the wall to drop the circles. Did they both handle the mechanics? Yes, but one handled it /better/.

Try comparing dragoons who have to interrupt the flow of their skills to back off an enemy / due to them jumping. If your DRG runs a rigid rotation, always doing the full 27 steps even when there's an interruption of 10+ seconds, they will lose more DPS than a dragoon that adapts around the rotation and reacts according to the downtime they get.

[kpxmanifesto]

The fact that it's even a question, rhetoric or not, would suggest there is a double standard. Because kicking someone for their inability to perform their role beit tanking or healing is rarely questioned.

That takes some serious mental gymnastics to arrive at that answer. As I said, no one even mentioned inability to perform tanking or healing roles. How did you even come to that conclusion? This sounds more like: "Oh, someone caught me in a logical fallacy. Might as well go along with it." Absolutely beyond reason. Can I quote you on that? It's actually kind of humorous.

[Eidolon]

That takes some serious mental gymnastics to arrive at that answer. As I said, no one even mentioned inability to perform tanking or healing roles. How did you even come to that conclusion? This sounds more like: "Oh, someone caught me in a logical fallacy. Might as well go along with it." Absolutely beyond reason.

Because we already see posts of people getting kicked for "Omg tank can't hold threat" and "omg healer let me die." It may not have happened to you, it may not have happened to your friends. But it DOES happen.

There are two times I get a que as in progress for a dungoun.

"Tank was an asshole."
"Tank couldn't hold threat."

I never get repped in on a DPS because "They couldn't do DPS", but this could be my own bias of not playing it as much.

[kpxmanifesto]

Because we already see posts of people getting kicked for "Omg tank can't hold threat" and "omg healer let me die." It may not have happened to you, it may not have happened to your friends. But it DOES happen.

There are two times I get a que as in progress for a dungoun.

"Tank was an asshole."
"Tank couldn't hold threat."

I never get repped in on a DPS because "They couldn't do DPS", but this could be my own bias of not playing it as much.

No, there were no posts before my initial post that said anything like that. My first post was on the first page. Just keep in mind that me and Masssterchef's exchange happened before anything tank related or healing related was even mentioned.

[Eidolon]

No, there were no posts before my initial post that said anything like that. My first post was on the first page.

hmn, perhaps I'm misunderstanding you guys (I'm a little loopy this morning. No idea why, sorry!)

But my understanding was, that she was basically saying we should be allowed to hold everyone to the same standard. We can see tanking/healing, because tanking = threat, and healing = my HP did(n't) hit 0, but there's no real way to hold DPS to the same standard as tanking/healing. Right now, a good tank and heal can basically outlive bad DPS. Likewise, a good DPS could kill something so fast that a bad healer or tank might not be as noticable.

What they were saying is that it seems somewhat unfair that you can kick Tanks/Heals for being Bad in their role, but if you show a DPS is bad in their role and someone wanted to remove a weaker link? That would somehow make them ... well...THE DEVIL

[kpxmanifesto]

snip

I get it. It's a good thing to hold everyone to the same standard. But it's also rude to just assume that someone holds a double standard.