Healers doing damage

[KisaiTenshi]

I don't know why you keep telling people that healers aren't meant to use their DPS skills except while playing the small portion of the game that is solo content. If you're trying to encourage more bad, lazy healers, that would be the way to do it.

Also, you don't actually need to kill much of anything to get credit in FATEs; either heal the crap out of players with the most enmity or tag every single mob. Enmity gets you credit, not kill count.

Besides, I never have issues with FATEs even as a level-synced SCH OR WHM. Our damage is sufficient, and we will never die; what more could you ask for?

If the game was meant to be a cookie-cutter-clone of every lame MMORPG out there, then every class would be required to DPS and never do group healing. That is the point that people are somehow not getting.

When you do SOLO content, the WHM has only one AOE, Holy. You don't get to use it for most of the FATES because it's a level 45 spell. ACN/SMN/SCH has Bio II (Level 26,) Thaumatuge/BLM has several AOE's you get at level 12 and 18.

When you go into any dungeon where you are levelsynced below level 45, you don't get to use Holy either. When people on the forum are suggesting that a healer that stands around doing nothing is not contributing by not DPS'ing, or that they are lazy, they are completely missing the point that the healer role is not meant to be a DPS class because it takes more effort than a stand-alone DPS class, and takes all the blame for the party wiping. What would suck more is if the game actually enforced the job rules, so say you're fighting a boss and everyone but you, the healer is dead, and you're going to wipe, but look the boss has 1% HP (this has happened), maybe I can throw a DoT and kite the boss while I hit regen. If I stop and try to cast anything else, dead.

That's my point. If you're expecting the healer to DPS while in a party, then you're not playing the game as it was intended. It's up to the healer to decide if they want to. If you have a healer in your party, that gives the tank and DPS more time to focus on damage. If you expect the healer to DPS (so effectively the entire party is DPS), then everyone would be responsible for their own healing by bringing a buttload of pots to spam (which can't be done in FFXIV anyway.) This is how it is in other MMORPG's, and this is why freemium games stop being fun (couldn't afford to cashshop-only useful pots, well guess you get left for dead.)

And this brings up another point that I've seen thrown around the forum...

Not everyone is a spreadsheet nerd. If you are so hardcore that everyone must be maximizing every last second of the boss battle, you're completely sucking the fun out of the game. It's a game, not a freaking job at McDonalds.

The point about the FATE's is that the game makes a lot of assumptions around SOLO or PARTY play. If I have to chase around low level FATE's to complete ATMA's where none of the FATE's in that zone are above level 40, then it's going to be impossible as the DPS will beat me to them every time. Want to know how I got the last ATMA for Western Thanalan and the last Atma for Central Thanalan? I camped the "boss" fates, because the trash mobs for the other fates were dead before I could cast anything but Aero.

[Lyzern]

When people on the forum are suggesting that a healer that stands around doing nothing is not contributing by not DPS'ing, or that they are lazy, they are completely missing the point that the healer role is not meant to be a DPS class because it takes more effort than a stand-alone DPS class

Ok, I see why you have that point of view. So let me clarify something: Dealing damage as a healer, is a thousand times easier than dealing damage as a DD. DDs have rotations, procs, positioning, damage buffs to be rotated, etc etc etc, healers don't. All healers have to do to deal damage is turn on Cleric Stance, throw in a couple of spells here and there, and that's it! Congratulations on being an above-average healer! You've done it simply by casting 3 or 4 spells more than you normally would, instead of:

looking at the screen... waiting... looking at bars... waiting... nothing happens? wait some more...

EXCITING!

[Alex_Lenderson]

If you're playing FFXIV as it was designed, the healer role is not meant to DPS inside the dungeons, but the option is there. If you want to play a healer who can DPS or a DPS who can heal, you pick Scholar/Summoner, but you still don't expect the DPS to heal any more than you expect the healer to DPS.

No. A healer who never casts an offensive spell is inefficient. Just like a DPS who gets lazy on their rotations.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

Someone's acting like some local school bully who bullies other kids who has higher grades than he does :P

The "fun" factor is seriously biased and subjective. What is "fun" anyway? One could consider football "fun", but I would pass on chasing a ball in the grass with sweaty grown men/women, thank you. So why can't making the most out of the class you like be considered "fun"?

That aside, so much more biased and subjective nonsense in there that doesn't even help elaborate your standpoint. This statement for example: "then you're not playing the game as it was intended". Exactly how was the game supposed to be played as intended? Do elaborate.

[Magusrex]

SNIP

The only reason i enjoy playing a healer in this game is because I can DPS. I got my atma just fine all you need is one aero on one mob and you have the same chance to get an Atma. Most dungeons pre 45 I can heal in Cleric Stance except for a couple of bosses, what a waste of skill and abilities standing around doing nothing. Low geared tank, very little dps from me I get that. Push yourself, improve, get better.

[Cynfael]

If the game was meant to be a cookie-cutter-clone of every lame MMORPG out there, then every class would be required to DPS and never do group healing. That is the point that people are somehow not getting.

Not quoting everything, but let's start here: how is pigeonholing the healer role into pure heal/buff somehow less cookie-cutter?

A few more points:

-Yes, standing around doing nothing when you could be contributing somehow is lazy and unfair to your party members who are actually playing well.

- Pure healing in this game is a very easy job if you're at all good at it. Please don't pretend that healers have it rough with playing at bare minimum expectation, because they don't. At least not any rougher than any other player has it with incompetent party members.

- Aero is literally all you need to get gold during trash mob FATEs swarmed by other players. Tag each mob as it spawns, and that's it. Identify a tank or other high-enmity AoE character and heal it if applicable. I've done plenty of FATEs as a solo WHM, and Holy is not the only tool in your box. Blizzard II also works well for tagging clumps of mobs in low-level FATEs.

- I highly doubt that you have the breadth of play experience in this game to tell other people what is intended and what is not, and I don't think that you truly appreciate the capabilities of your own class.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

inb4 another elitist accusation

[Cynfael]

inb4 another elitist accusation

*passes the popcorn to Lyrica*

You can have all my popcorn, actually. I don't need it, being an elitist, fun-sucking vampire who plays from McDonald's.

[Magusrex]

I am so tired of hearing "elitist" in MMO forums. You join group content to complete it with other people. No one is expecting you to be great, or have the perfect build, study spreadsheets ect. You always take the argument there though, because it makes us easier to attack. What I want, and what most other competent players want is that if join group content you make a reasonable attempt to perform as well as you can. That means knowing the abilities of your job and to perform them reasonably well. If you know you wipe groups, seek out some information to attempt to improve. What upsets me and others is "I play this game for fun, it is my subscription." That is true, but there is a social convention in these games that you are trying to accomplish a common goal and it would be polite to try and help to the best of your abilities. I know that there have been times that my DPS has been the only thing that saved our group. I chose to become familiar with the skills, and became good at stance dancing so when the situation arose I was ready and capable to perform for my group. If I was not somewhat comfortable there would have been no way to pull that off. The only reason I do those things is because I care about the experience of others, that does not make elitist or hardcore, it means I am considerate and thoughtful.

[Risvertasashi]

I think KisaiTenshi makes one very good point, though. The healer is responsible for keeping the party alive and if anyone dies or we wipe, we WILL get the blame. (Especially in Cleric, even if the cause is they didn't avoid a telegraph).

Personally, if I'm in any doubt-- the tank is doing things that make me a bit nervous (or DPS for that matter)-- I just stay out of CS. Even if I then look back and think "I could have worked in a triple or quadro holy afterall". At least no one's dead.

The other times I don't really DPS is when I'm really tired. Some times I just got done raiding or doing something, I'm trying to get the EX bonus before I sleep... So I'm just kind of half consciously spot healing where needed and not doing much else.

Lastly, I'll point out that DPSing is a lot easier on SCHs than WHMs. SCHs have the off-GCD, insta-cast lustrate which isn't affected by CS, and CS doesn't nerf the fairy either (unless you summon her with it on).

I won't resent a healer that only heals, though. As long as we're alive. DPSing should be a personal choice, IMO. I do it when I think I can get away with it. Heals first, however. And there are various reasons for one to not play at their peak all the time, especially in laughable content such as EX roulette. Hopefully all that doesn't make me a horrible, inefficient healer :)