Can someone give me an in-depth explanation why Summoner is arguably the worst DPS?

[Huntington]

snip

You could probably say everything you want just as effectively without being a bass, just so you're aware.

Like Avatar's Favor ? (from XI...)

I could get behind this, though it opens up a lot of problems. Such as being asked to use a certain pet that might not be as optimal as another... or being asked to switch a pet mid fight for certain buffs, further sh*tting on our MP conservation. But if they did give buffs...?

Ifrit: STR Bonus or Melee DPS Increase?
Garuda: INT Bonus or Magic DPS increase?
Titan: VIT Bonus or Defense increase?
(Ramuh): DEX bonus or Ranged DPS increase?
(Leviathan): MND Bonus or Healing Potency Increase?

I like these suggestions quite a bit. People, maybe only a few, maybe several thousand, have been clamoring for pets to be utilized in a fashion where the SMN will switch them around constantly as a fight changes. Utilizing each pet and not just parking it right on Garuda for 95% of most content would be an amazing way to actually feel like a SMN if you're swapping around your pets to get different benefits for your party. When the expansion hits and we get our guaranteed Ramuh egi, and the to be confirmed Leviathan Egi, if they gave them statuses like what you said, I'd like that quite a bit.
If we did that, made Contagion an actual SMN cooldown instead of having it be tied to Garuda, and then I saw someone else's suggestion that Fester crits could give an additional Aetherflow stack. That allows you even more possible uses and possible gained stacks if you're lucky, and if needed, you can probably use an Energy Drain for the additionals if the RNG is working with you. I know people have said that Energy Drain is a DPS loss through and through if you're not using Fester, but no one should honestly care if you're still Fester'ing just as much if not even more depending on how often you are crit'ing and getting those bonus Aetherflows. This way, since Fester is tied to SMN and Energy Drain is on ACN, there would not need to be an adjusting to Energy Drain to help SMN with it's MP issues and mess up the perfect flow that SCH has right now.

[ilmynasa]

There's no point in discussing this topic like this, since people obvious are on different grounds.

This is what smn who have cleared T13 or close to it feels about blm:
You just have to work so hard to achieve the same level of dps as a blm. Personally the effort in playing smn to achieve the same level of dps as a blm or a good brd is just ridiculous. I've been playing smn since 2.0, and I have to say I am proud of my dps for almost hitting 480ish on T13, but compared to my static's blm who just started playing like a month ago (switched back to blm) and doing 450dps, I feel mistreated. And I have a good idea of where other T13 clear smn's dps is around......

So to the casual:
You guys can argue what utilities smn have, for the small portion of us who are HC progression, we all know what smn can do. What's smn utility? Is it edible? lulz. I don't think I can argue this point with anyone who haven't cleared T12 yet, our worlds are just too different.

/end of rant

[Nexus_Limitless]

Summoner would be cool if they were a little more like Summoners were in past Final Fantasy games, where they can summon powerful primals after you've defeated them. I was disappointed to see Summoners in this game are pretty much the same thing a Magician was in Everquest, a mage who can summon elemental pets, making them effective at soloing? With the Chocobo companion, I'm not really sure what the appeal of summoners is.

Summoners should have more variety, have it they can gain a new summon for each Primal. Some could do Status effects, giving them more utility. Not sure why they made Scholar separate from Summoner, but for Summoner to be more useful I think the fairy and more should be among their summons, allowing them to fill more roles depending on what they summon. By having Summoner and Scholar branch into two separate jobs, a Summoner is essentially just inferior dps.

[point09micron]

Summoner and Scholar being split jobs is almost certainly in reaction to Summoners in FFXI being regarded by the community as a 4th tier healer to invite, if no White Mage, Red Mage, or Scholar is available, for most of the game's lifespan.

As for making SMN more like their earlier incarnations, there's not a good way to do it. Early incarnations were basically Black Mages with longer casting times, more MP, and less HP. There's no good way to make something like that fit into the FFXIV gameplay.

[Nexus_Limitless]

I think with Summoners they had an opportunity to make it something really cool, considering how much primals play into the story and Summoners having some of the coolest attacks in many of the older Final Fantasy games. What they ended up doing makes the class feel like a clone of pet classes from older mmorpgs, rather than being based on Final Fantasy summoners.

When I first got this game, I made a Archanist. Didn't even get to lvl 20 in my first month and didn't renew my subscription. Later when my brother and some friends got Final Fantasy, I created a new Character on the same server as them. This one I made an Archer/Bard, got to lvl 50 within a month and the credits for beating Ultima Weapon in less than a month. If as a summoner you can't ever summon any of the big primals, its like the jobs capped at being a apprentice without it being possible to become a master summoner.

[Lilyarel]

, I'm not really sure what the appeal of summoners is.

Its just to feel like a hipster atm. When Summoners get a pity buff they'll all go "I was playing this job before it was cool, youre all posers."
Dont deny it Summoner mains.

[Lavieh]

Thinks game balance is the same as high school students and fashion

Enough said. Pretty pathetic.

[Lilyarel]

Enough said. Pretty pathetic.

How mature.
Also you'd be pretty surprised how often something like that happens.

[Lavieh]

How mature.
Also you'd be pretty surprised how often something like that happens.

As I am aware of bandwagon and how it works, associating a class balance with a "Pity buff" is extremely naive.

[Nexus_Limitless]

Although its good to know you guys have a hard time with mana, black mage can fill their own mana fast enough they'd rather have the elemental damage increase song. White mages usually can manage their mana without it, but need it if they get low.

Often times there is no DPS mage in the group, so I don't get to use my songs very much. So I'll play Mage Ballad more often when there are summoners in the group if it helps. I like to use my songs as much as possible, which is why I'm always glad to have a DPS mage in the group. Most mages tell me to turn it off if I put it on and forget to take it off when they fill up.