The Real Problem with Zodiac (Tank Speedrun Woes)

[Cyrus-Wallace]

But if you find 3 people out of 4 that want to SR the dungeon, then the 4th player is the one that is off. It's the same situation, in DF there're no specific rules. And yeah, the argument of using the PF is flawed, because we can even say the same here "If you want a slow run, PF"; "If you want a SR, PF", "If you want a sac pulling run, PF", "If you want to watch CS, PF", etc. You will do whatever they want to do if they're majority. If you/they don't agree, they can kick you without being punished by the rules, because it goes against their "gameplay", as already stated. Granted, you're a tank, they are hard to find... but we're not entitled to make them do what we want. It's true that I perceive tanks as a leader, but one thing is being a leader and other thing is being a boss. You can't force people to do what you want.

On my experience, I finished my zodiac by mostly using DF, and almost EVERY run was a speedrun. No one complained. Ever. Following my own experience... Sometimes, when I see the tank is good, as a healer I pull more for him. I know I can heal through it. The DPS most of the time thank me about it. The tanks never complained. When I play tank, I ask the healer if he feels comfortable with big pulls, checking the DPS if they can manage it. If I play DPS, it's up to the tank and healer. I suggest it but I won't force them to do it.

[Purrfectstorm]

Granted, you're a tank, they are hard to find... but we're not entitled to make them do what we want.

I agree with you 100%. But you can't ever be MADE to do better than your best. Nor should you have to "drive" faster than you are comfortable. There are speedruns where you finish a dungeon quickly (imo 15-20 min), there are speedruns where you shave off a few min (13-14 min), and then there are speedruns where you're aiming for completely unrealistic numbers. I think the first case is reasonable of a DF speedrun but probably not the other two.

In other words, it's not necessarily a case of WON'T but a case of CAN'T. When it's to my benefit to complete as fast as possible, I'm not going "slow" on purpose and I don't think a 1-2 min slower run (or any amount of minutes) justifies the abuse I've witnessed.

[Cyrus-Wallace]

charlimit

Sadly, some players think everybody play like they do or they'll find people equally geared or that follow their strategy as if it was a universal thing, and that's a common mistake. I agree with you with that point, there're limits. You'll (Not you as you, but as a random player) find yourself in a tough situation if you don't meet the expectative of the other three guys. sometimes they'll understand and slow down, sometimes they won't. They will either kick you or they're going to rage quit. Again, it'll be what the majority wants. :/ DF is a russian roulette. Unfortunately, we can't control the people that join it... it's a hit or miss.

But the point is and I agree with it, this kind of content feeds these attitudes, but let's be honest... almost every part of the relic/zodiacal questline was used as a competitive thing. People want to hurry up, people want to get the new shiny thing NOW. People don't care about others until they accomplish their goals. This segment of the questline might be an exception, since I noticed itwas very welcoming to new players as well. That extra Soldiery? yes, please.