The Real Problem with Zodiac (Tank Speedrun Woes)

[Kazumac]

It's a group decision, if one person's gear, skill or willingness to speed run is lacking, it just isn't going to end well. I personally think it is fun but in DF you don't know what you are going to get so pulling huge groups just to die b/c the dps can't AOE down before cool downs run out, tank doesn't rotate cool downs maximally or the healer has their head in the sand just isn't worth it time wise. So I don't insist on it or get upset if someone in the group doesn't want to do it. (As a tank I'll still chain pull group after group as long as the healer mana is good)

The other day I was berated extensively as a healer because I wouldn't help a dpser push our tank to do a speed run. The tanks gear was fine for it but it wasn't their main job and they weren't comfortable with it. It was quite funny seeing the dpser tell me how horrible I was as a healer because I was dpsing a lot of the run instead of healing exclusively (no one died but him and that's because he didn't hide on Fenrir b/c he was too busy yelling at me) I guess he really didn't want to go faster... He just wanted a speed run lol.

[FranSeara]

Did a tam tara HM speed run with an i70 scholar healing. Not a single death, so, sounds like you are just bad.

Eeerr!! NO. I've Healed all the way up to T9 and all ex primals. I only have this problem with sorry Axx Tanks in DFs only joining for Bonus and not really knowing how to tank or how use cool downs. Mass pulling without saying anything is their mistake. Biting off more then they can handle is their mistake not mine.

[FranSeara]

Er. I have a much easier time healing huge pulls as a scholar than as a white mage, honestly. >.>

Lustrate being off the GCD is extremely powerful, not to mention all the damage mitigation.

Err!! same for you. Mas pulling without warning is the tank's fault, not mine.

[Elim]

lol. I see people complain about wait times because of the lack of tanks. But when a tank makes a mistake(maybe pulls a little too much or not enough), someone always seems to call him names and berates him. Very harshly. That's not the way to encourage more people to play tanks.

[Ashkendor]

Eeerr!! NO. I've Healed all the way up to T9 and all ex primals. I only have this problem with sorry Axx Tanks in DFs only joining for Bonus and not really knowing how to tank or how use cool downs. Mass pulling without saying anything is their mistake. Biting off more then they can handle is their mistake not mine.

Okay, so you've healed up to T9. So have a lot of people. And? I've tanked all the way up to T9 and EX primals and I've also healed many of those fights. That really doesn't matter, though. As long as the Scholar is geared, there's no reason they can't heal a speed run. I would much rather heal a mass pull on SCH instead of WHM.

Err!! same for you. Mas pulling without warning is the tank's fault, not mine.

Erm. You're the one that flat out said "I can't heal speed runners" as a Scholar. There was no qualifier there about pulling without warning (though actually, you can recover situations like that in a lot of cases with Sprint and a few well placed Lustrates) or not using cooldowns properly. "I don't understand why they pull 18 groups of mobs with a Scholar healer" says to me that you think SCH is somehow inferior for a mass pull, which I assure you it is not.

[Xenor]

If you don't want to speed run then you'd better be an exceptional tank at keeping hate because whenever I find a tank who doesn't speed run they can never keep hate on the pulls where my Quelling Strikes isn't available. I could half ass the dungeon like the tank and watch TV and hit random buttons to avoid that but I rather play my job to its best and get through there ASAP. If only the tanks did the same.

If you don't know the most efficient speed run tactic that's fine, but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out you can pull two or three sets of mobs when they're on your screen ahead of you.

[HakuroDK]

As a tank, I don't like speedrunning all that much, especially when the two DPS in the party are melee DPS that can't AoE worth a damn.

Here is my process:

-Wait for Protect/Stoneskin
-Tank one group at a time
-Hit the Ready Check at the start of each boss to make sure no one's being left behind.
-Conserve TP by using Steel Cyclone as much as possible.

In overpulls with DPS that outgear me (I'm currently i106 and I've been outaggro'd by BLMs, even when using 3 or 4 overpowers in a row at the start.), I can't do a damn thing, and all it ends up causing me is annoyance because either I use Overpower 10 times per pull and wait for my TP to regen after every single pull, or I use it 3-4 times initially and use my Butcher's Block rotation while cycling targets, and the DPS decide to attack two different targets and pull enmity from both.

And then there are those people who get annoyed when I don't pull more than one group at a time (especially healers and bards, for some reason), and they decide to run away from the party to kite the next group to me. I pick it up because I'm not a vindictive asshole, but my god that really has to stop. I'm Rouletting so that I can gear up, so if I get out-pulled by DPS who have Final Coil gear already, I don't believe that to be as much my fault when I do everything properly.

I H-A-T-E when people say it's always the tank's fault when enmity is pulled off the tank. Because tanking is not as easy as it looks. That's why most people prefer to play DPS, because only people with parsers can actually tell when a DPS is being lazy. I mean my god, when I play DPS now (usually to level my DPS jobs or to use my MNK to help out my fellow tank friends), I find myself in the habit of keeping my eyes on the enmity gauge and making absolutely sure I don't steal enmity while still putting out DPS by either switching targets or stopping all DPS until enmity is better established.

[Elim]

I now dred DFs as Heals now. Its not that I'am a Bad healer but I can't heal speed runners. I don't understand why they pull 18 groups of mobs with a Scholar Healer. None of my spells are going to save them from 3,000-4,000 points of damage per sec. I wanna save them, but can't heal them for that much that fast. geez
lol

I can heal speed runs in any dungeon perfectly as both sch and whm.

One good example: my friend pulled every mob, including the wolves, at the start of Snow Cloak on his ilv98 tank and I healed him through it on my SCH without any issue.