We have finally come full circle, SMN's need help!

[Ryans]

Because melee dps now have Ninja to goad them and no longer need paeon, bards should be using foe's. And if a bard needs to ballad for one smn it is a bigger dps loss. In old content the enrage times were smaller making sustaining dps much easier, the longer the fight smn has no way to get mp back at a manageable rate without harming their own dps.

Melee still need paeon with the tp increase to ninjas. It used to be viable as Ninja could last through even t8 with invigorate, but that isn't the case anymore.

[Sleigh]

Melee still need paeon with the tp increase to ninjas. It used to be viable as Ninja could last through even t8 with invigorate, but that isn't the case anymore.

It doesn't change the fact that playing Army's Paeon for 2 tanks and 3 other DoW is highly valuable and worth the 20% BRD damage decrease temporarily, while playing Ballad for one SMN who does less than everyone else, at the same damage loss for the BRD, is quite silly.

TP song is going to happen with or without SMN. SMN tied to the same resource pool (IE basically needs MP song to do well) is very bad balance wise, all things considered.

[Ryans]

It doesn't change the fact that playing Army's Paeon for 2 tanks and 3 other DoW is highly valuable and worth the 20% BRD damage decrease temporarily, while playing Ballad for one SMN who does less than everyone else, at the same damage loss for the BRD, is quite silly.

TP song is going to happen with or without SMN. SMN tied to the same resource pool (IE basically needs MP song to do well) is very bad balance wise, all things considered.

The problem is that the only other caster has a limitless mana pool. Ballad should be needed just as much as paeon depending on the composition of your party. But it isn't. The only reason to use ballad is if your healers are low on mp. All casters should last longer than melee before running dry, but only by a minute to two minutes. Either change Blm (perhaps a goad for mp if they don't want to change their unlimited mana) or add more casters that actually have to manage resources to make ballad useful.

Or just make real support classes. It has been a long time coming. We don't need the trinity anymore.