are WHMs hard to come by?

[Velox]

SCH is harder to play due to it being a DPS/Support/Healer hybrid job (it's seriously a jack-of-all trades role), but that also makes it more rewarding because it brings an entire party makeup worth of skills to each battle (it can heal, buff, debuff, dps, mitigate, etc). However, it also has amazing MP recovery (20% MP every minute + additional skill for emergencies), instant heals (3 every 60s), and pet support, so it's a lot more forgiving of a job. Even a lackluster SCH can function in end-game with minimal difficulty, but will lack efficiency if its not timing mitigation with the fight's mechanics. A lackluster party won't have much of an effect on a SCH due to their greater MP regen and assistance healing by the fairy.

WHM is a pure healer with 90% of its toolset going towards aiding total healing potential, which makes it easier to play. Because of this, it's one of the most boring roles out there and many people avoid it in favor of SCH. On top of this, while the toolkit is simple, it has a much higher learning curve due to its lack of MP regeneration and massive heals which bring massive enmity. To make matters worse, its only means to mitigate enmity is tied to its MP regeneration, so a WHM has to constantly assess when he/she should use it because it has a 2 minute cooldown timer. (Is it more important for MP or enmity reduction at this point, and will I need it again within the 2 minute downtime?) This makes WHM a lot less forgiving of a job when mistakes are made, either by you or someone in your party. A lackluster WHM will cripple your party by keeping the BRD from using Foes or ripping mobs off the tank with excessive healing. A lackluster party can cripple a WHM by requiring them to waste precious MP on healing avoidable damage, or raising those KO'd.

To summarize the 2 roles
A SCH is proactive healer/mitigator that requires a different mindset other than "I see damage, I heal it."
A WHM is a reactive healer with longer cast times that must be compensated for.
A SCH has an advanced toolkit and brings a ton of utility to a party, but is more forgiving when mistakes are made.
A WHM has a simple toolkit and can't do much other than heal, but is less forgiving and requires a ton of patience.
A SCH is more of an independent healer, and can hold its own even with a bad party composition.
A WHM is very party-dependent, and can't function well without decent players around him/her.

[DreamWeaver]

Please just stop calling WHM Reactive Healers .

It's harder to play a Proactive WHM compared to a Proactive SCH, but that's no reason to label WHM as Reactive Healers.

[Lyrica_Ashtine]

snip

You were so close that I almost spend the effort to push the Like button. But alas, no dice. Simply due to your summary. I agree on the points you made that a white mage learning curve is steeper, it's also less forgiving for dropping the ball in situations. However, I don't agree on that a white mage is a reactive healer (or should be). If anything, scholars are allowed to be more reactive than white mage simply for the fact they have Lustrate. However, a proactive scholar is more likely to spend that aetherflow stack on Energy Drain, rather than lustrate, or uses it to extend the time allowed to stay in Cleric's Stance. If a white mage is reactive, however, the heals may be late and someone dies for it - Remember I mentioned it's less forgiving?

Healing fundamentals are the same for both healers, however. Know your class, know the encounter and know the party. White Mages just have to be a bit more vigilant than scholars when it comes to healing. Luckily, healing for endgame content is never alone (bar e-peen reasons) and you can pick up each other's mistakes.

This post is very enlightening about healing in general. For both scholar and white mage: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post2369855

[Velox]

I am sorry, I should have clarified. A "reactive healer" is not the same as reactive healing.

Reactive healing (verb) is a practice in which the user waits until someone has taken damage before deciding to heal them up. Situations that require reactive healing will vary (such as a player taking avoidable damage). On a scripted fight, healing is still done proactively by casting just before damage is taken, if allowed.
A "reactive healer" (noun) is a job type in which the role's functions are dictated first by whether or not someone has suffered damage. A WHM is a reactive healer because most of its healing potential can only be achieved once damage is taken. The job NEEDs damage to function. Adversely, a "proactive healer" has tools that prevent damage from occurring in the first place (what we call mitigation).

In scripted fights, a reactive healer still heals proactively.

Both WHM and SCH have some skills that favor both reactive healing and proactive healing, but for the most part a WHM is defined as a reactive healer (lacks mitigation, stronger heals) and SCH is defined as a proactive healer (has mitigation, weaker heals). Both healers must always be proactively healing scripted fights (we call this pre-casting) and reacting to unexpected damage when it occurs (post-casting). I addressed this in the line where it says, "...longer cast times that must be compensated for."

Part of what makes both healers so viable in end-game content is that 99% of it is still scripted, so both can shine. However, if SE were to ever design a true RNG fight (in which an enemy's attacks are put on individual timers instead of a rotation, and AI chooses which active ones he/she uses next) a proactive healer like SCH would be at a great disadvantage. They would simply never know when to use their mitigation spells for peak efficiency (the boss might do that raid-wide AoE now, or in 3 minutes) and this creates fights that require almost purely reactive healing. This would make WHM the stronger healer because it has traded shields for higher recovery rates. If we were to ever see these kinds of fights in the future, SE would have to completely redesign SCH and both jobs would drift so close to each other in terms of strengths/weaknesses that they would lose their identities. I know none of this is really relevant to the current game, but it's still interesting to think about.

[DreamWeaver]

@Velox,

Can I assume your mitigation is Adlo and not much on E4E (luck based + not available for every big hit) and Virus (CD related + not available for every big hit)?

If so...who says WHM do not have mitigation, we have the mighty StoneSkin!!

[DreamWeaver]

@Komoritane,

If I am not wrong, I think they meant outside combat Stone Skin becoming party-wide cast? During combat it will still remain as a single target buff.

[Cynfael]

Unless I die I don't need to touch Energy Drain. Lustrate is more of a primary healing spell than a reactive one (like Cure II), since Adlo doesn't really heal enough to make it worth casting regularly, unless you're over geared for the content.

Energy Drain is a great DPS tool and shouldn't be overlooked when you don't have a pressing need to heal as quickly as Lustrate allows. I also wouldn't discourage people from using Adlo regularly since the Galvanize effect can be so powerful and can facilitate further assistant DPS with the time it buys you.

It's true that Physick is ideal for filling up large chunks of missing HP at low MP cost, which is helpful for certain phases of end-game raids where tanks actually get chunked now and then (or frequently and over a long period of time, like in T8), but otherwise it's just about keeping the tank shielded and topped off for as long as possible so that you can keep up DPS with minimal interruption.

[Cynfael]

@ Cynfael

Good point, I don't usually consider Energy Drain for DPS since I tend to need the Lustrates with the parties I get in Duty Finder. Even with galvanize, I don't usually find much use for Adlo in full party (8 member) content, but maybe that's because I'm saving my Lustrates. Succor right before an AoE is quite useful for the galvanize effect. Agree that Physick should only be used following Adlo since galvanize doesn't stack. I might reconsider my Energy Drain vs. Lustrate ratio based on your post, though. Thanks!

DF can certainly be a crapshoot, so I hear you there. If I actually need to heal, I won't be blowing lots of stacks on Energy Drain, but common DF things like Light farms are easy enough for most people that I can safely blow through my stacks in my opening DPS rotation, pop Aetherflow anew, use a couple of Energy Drain or Banes, and save one stack just in case until my Aetherflow is about to refresh again.

[Velox]

@Velox,

Can I assume your mitigation is Adlo and not much on E4E (luck based + not available for every big hit) and Virus (CD related + not available for every big hit)?

If so...who says WHM do not have mitigation, we have the mighty StoneSkin!!

Haha very true, Stoneskin is a nice asset, even with its ridiculous cast time and MP cost :P

As far as mitigation-heavy vs. recovery-heavy, I tend to define my roles based on the overall sum of each rather than individual skills (even though one may end up using a single skill 10x more than the others) because it helps show total potential that way.


For recovery, WHM has access to:
Cure, Cure II, Cure III, Medica, Medica II, Regen, and Benediction
For mitigation (including buffs and debuffs), WHM has access to:
Stoneskin, Protect, Holy (stun does interrupt damage), Virus, and Eye for an Eye

For recovery, SCH has access to:
Physick, Adloquium, Succor, Embrace, Lustrate, and Whispering Dawn
For mitigation (including buffs and debuffs), SCH has access to:
Adloquium, Succor, Sacred Soil, Fey Covenant, Silent Dawn, Shadow Flare, Virus, Eye for an Eye, Ruin II, Stoneskin, and Protect

NOTE: I decided to cross out the items in the list that are shared between both so the uncrossed skills are the ones that job brings to the table just itself and not the common denominators. Physick and Cure are copy+paste skills so I did them as well.

Due to this, WHM strength is in overall recovery and is lacking in mitigation. A WHM becomes a valuable asset when the party is taking a ton of damage, which is why they are reactive healers. SCH excels in mitigation, but lacks brute recovery strength when the party is taking fire. This is why I label them as proactive healers.

WHM are reactive healers because they are at their best when people need recovery.
SCH are proactive healers because they are at their best when damage needs to be stopped.

[DreamWeaver]

Personally I feel comparing skill to skill is pointless, as it's the actual execution/skill usage that counts.

IE: You mention Scholar has Adlo and Stone Skin, WHM has Stone Skin, thus both stone skin cancels each other out, but I dunno about you, personally I seldom see Scholars use Stoneskin to mitigate big hits.

Another Example will be Sacred Soil/Shadow Flare, you listed there as both being an option, but the truth is these 2 are mutually exclusive to each other, and since SF does not required Aetherflow like S Soil, many Scholars have prefered SF over SSoil.

A last example will be Succor, honestly speaking outside of Savage Coil and Mega Flare, I do not see the need to mitigate raid damage in any way, WHM's raid healing capability is extremely powerful and although Succor/SSoil helps mitigate some damage, it will not mitigate enough for the WHM to use Medica instead of Medica II, and even without your mitigation, one Medica II is more than enough to heal the raid back to full.

Additionally : If you add Silent Dusk's silence and Ruin II's blind as mitigation, please add Fluid Aura's Knock back as mitigation as well :P