Yoshi and Team treading that fine line

[Prototype909]

They aren't nerfing Savage Coil. That will be a different aspect to challenge yourself on, one of which most groups won't bother with attempting.

Because there's no meaningful reward there. Difficult content doesn't mean anything if there's no reward worth it to most players. And you can bet the reason that it's never going to be nerfed is -because- there's no rewards worth having in it, because if there were people would complain about it being exclusionary until it did get nerfed just like normal Coil.

[Kyri]

Because there's no meaningful reward there. Difficult content doesn't mean anything if there's no reward worth it to most players. And you can bet the reason that it's never going to be nerfed is -because- there's no rewards worth having in it, because if there were people would complain about it being exclusionary until it did get nerfed just like normal Coil.

The title is a meaningful reward. People in FFXI would struggle to take down Vrtra, but they didn't particularly want the cashmere.. they wanted the title, because people would examine them and see "Vrtra Vanquisher", and that alone was worth it to them.

[VicViperion]

Again, that creates an experience only one group of people will ever experience. Which is terrible game design. We're not talking about CoP and seven years later, we're only talking about a few months.

So you'll be running all the old instances to get people up to the current tier right? No? Just like other players won't be running them? Old content has to be nerfed, because no one has an interest in it. How many people do you see doing the old HM's/Ex's these days? Not many, it's outdated. The original Ex's were outdated on release, given everyone by then had plenty of time to get their i90 Relics, but people did them because it was new. And thats the key word. "New". New content will get played. Old content WILL be ignored. And thats why it has to be nerfed-So new players, can catch up. New players aren't interested in content everyone tells them is outdated. They want to get to the big leagues, frequently just so they can play with their friends.

[Havenchild]

I'm on the fence with this issue. Being part of the End-Game community several T9 clears under my belt, I don't want to see these amazing fights get nerfed at all because they are very well made fights and the sense of accomplishment you get from dealing with all the different pits of hell you can fall into and then finally come out victorious feels amazing.

On the other hand, I know the average player is not of my skill level or even that of the end-game community more often then not, (Doesn't know how to play their class optimally, for example), which would mean that finding a team to play jump-rope with is even harder. So for this reason, I can see why the echo is warranted if they keep most of the original mechanics, granted the echo will do more harm then good in fights like T7.

For the people who say, they have so many RL priorities that they welcome a nerf, you are a problem as well with this issue. Content being curtailed solely to people who apparently can't waste time into learning mechanics of a fight weekly, is not healthy for the longevity of the game you so call enjoy.

Both groups should be considerate of the other, the hardcore raiders should be mindful that, on the other side of things, people on different servers struggle to form a solid competent static. Casuals/Mainstream should come to understand that the hardest content in the game has a right to maintain it's difficulty because nothing else is that difficult in this game.

People more often then not seem to be convinced that you don't need people from the other side of the fence in this game. Without the hardcore community/end game content, this game would lose people fast and flop because there would be nothing eventful happening once you hit 50. Without the casuals, you would have nothing to fuel your market with gear, food, potions, currency, and more importantly subscriptions to pay for that end-game content as well.

Too much nut tugging from both sides in this thread. Should just be helping each other out without asking for hand-outs.

I didn't think people cared about content that they wouldn't run anymore once it gets outdated.

We care about the content because it's some of the best scripted fights in-game that actually offer suitable challenge despite stronger gear. Coil atm, comprises the only current end-game content in this game. A total of 9 separate instances(8 actual battle-driven boss fights) atm out of like 60+

[MilesSaintboroguh]

I didn't think people cared about content that they wouldn't run anymore once it gets outdated.

[Zohnax]

derp

Nexus says, "Hi." There's ways to keep old content semi-relevant if you're smart about it. Also, I'm sorry you can't read. I never said they didn't ever need a nerf. I said, they don't need to be nerfed into the ground.

There were accessories from Ex that were an alternative to Coil and even some Coil people went for them. It wasn't just about the i90 weapons, and they're about to be relevant again with people who still want their mounts now that they're getting a droprate boost. You're also implying that anyone new that joins is a friend of someone already in end-game. What if a group of friends start at the bottom? Stop making bad assumptions coupled with misinformation.

[Ellatrix]

wut

Saying Ex primals are outdated on release.. you have no idea what you're talking about. i90 relic was behind 3 weeks of myth to obtain; primal focus allowed you to obtain one i90 weapon per week so it was very much relevant. In addition to that, they also rewarded i90 accessories. They were very much relevant for all of 2.1.

Plenty of people are still running old content.

Just get your Binding Coil of Bahamut - Turn 5 (Story) run that rewards no gear or achievement with anything remotely challenging removed, then both sides can be happy.

[SinisterIsBack]

Practice so you can Suck Less™. Coil2 can be full cleared in i90 gear.

but but but, they don't wanna work for anything.................

[Wizel]

How about adding a new "casual mode" for coil-2 like they did with savage coil?

With casual mode you can see the story, experience a decently hard fight but you are penalized with no/low loot drops and the only reward is tomestones. This will allow three different levels of challenge for people, easy = limited rewards, normal = fight stays like it is and people can enjoy it if they want with no nerfs to the mechanics, savage = people that really want to test their skills.

Only issue I can see with this is people that do not have the ability will gain access to the next coil step and that might cause problems with group forming.

[Kyri]

I wish I understood the logic...

The people that have cleared the content are lamenting that the content difficulty will be lowered and that it will somehow ruin their play experience, even though at the time of this posting those same people have probably got the whole experience down to a "gather on Tuesday, clear Coils, see you next week" sort of thing. They also lament that "Second Coil is the only challenge left in the game", when Final Coil is coming out at the exact same time that difficulty adjustments are being planned for Second Coil.

So.. they're complaining about the difficulty being lowered in a dungeon that they probably won't be running anymore (because they'll be in Final Coil) and that doesn't even really offer a challenge to them anymore... because it will take away the challenge from their gaming experience?

I just don't get it.