Challenging 4-Man Content Please

[Zumi]

You can't just keep lumping old content that has become easy due to higher gear as easy content. Coil 1, when it first came out was pretty much exclusively for the hard core. Its like I already said they have a mix of easy and hard content. 4 man content will never be hard because it relies on far fewer people thus less chances to make mistakes.

[Toodles]

1st Coil & 2nd Coil are essentially just two 8-man Dungeons.

Hardcores get SOOO much less than Casuals, it's not even funny.

And honestly, it wouldn't be that hard to implement Extreme-Dungeons.

Ilvl Sync to Minimum & add mechanics.

[Zumi]

1st Coil & 2nd Coil are essentially just two 8-man Dungeons.

Hardcores get SOOO much less than Casuals, it's not even funny.

Only that a lot more work and mechanics is put into coil bosses vs dungeon bosses which have very simple mechanics (don't stand in the stuff on ground and tank and spank for the most part)

[Irkmnstrs]

At least it gives me a reason to use Selene because they aren't healing intensive, lol.

[Nestama]

You can't just keep lumping old content that has become easy due to higher gear as easy content.

Point missed. Casual players have 11 dungeons, 2 raids and 3 watered down raids to catch up if the new dungeons require a high ilvl to enter (say i95. That can easily be reached by just doing Hunts).

Its like I already said they have a mix of easy and hard content. 4 man content will never be hard because it relies on far fewer people thus less chances to make mistakes.

2.0 Amdapor Keep (Demon Wall) and 2.1 Pharos Sirius (overall) say hi. Maybe Copperbell Mines, too. Some of the bosses in 2.2 and 2.3 did not have any interesting mechanics to them at all, nor punished players for one reason or another (PS punished players for trying to zerg. Amdapor Keep punished players for not being geared. Copperbell punished players for not paying attention).

• Brayflox: Ignore adds on first boss and zerg. Ignore adds on second boss and zerg. Quit dungeon and repeat OR beat final boss, which actually had mechanics that punished players.

• Halatali: Zerg first boss, press button, Manawall, repeat. Zerg second boss, blind self, kill eye, repeat. Zerg gladiators, zerg Lalafell, press button to unfreeze party members, repeat. Kill Kirin.

• Tam-Tara: Stand behind first boss, zerg. Have boss face away from Lalafell, zerg boss, DPS run into orbs, repeat. Zerg Avere, kill adds, repeat.

• Hullbreaker Isle: Zerg first boss, maybe kill adds, activate banana, repeat. Zerg second boss, get in bubbles, repeat. Kill tentacles, jump to new island to drop whirlpool, repeat.

2.1 (this includes Labyrinth of the Ancients as well. Even the "trash mobs" punished players), Lost City of Amdapor and Stone Vigil are currently the only patch dungeons that have all three bosses with certain mechanics to them that can punish players in one way or another (not all, but most).

Just to add, Fresh 50 players, or anyone who stopped playing before finishing 2.3's storyline, will need to do 2.4's storyline to unlock Snowcloak (and probably Expert Roulette), as Snowcloak is going to be the requirement to unlock Shiva HM... really unsure what this means for the dungeons difficulty, though.

[Zumi]

I didn't find either of those you mentioned hard. I play on a legacy server most of my FC had all the jobs to 50 when 2.0 came out. When we finished the main story quest to unlock the dungeons 2 days after 2.0 was out. FC group ran AK all day. We did WP once but then found that AK was better due to it giving more points.

In AK demon wall usually died before the bugs even came out. If you found demon wall hard it was because there were a lot of people who only play FFXI and never any kind of action oriented game couldn't understand not to stand in the black stuff and get in the center for the push back but it was a very simple pattern to follow but the masses can fail. Then someone found out about speed runs and how you could just skip the trash which let you spam the dungeon in 10 min. We had almost all our jobs in full darklight before SE nerfed speed runs.

Did PS with a FC group on the first day it was out didn't find it particularly hard either but it took 30 min to do which was a lot longer then other dungeons and thus not worth the time for same rewards. SE basically doesn't give you a reason to touch longer dungeons as long as they offer the same rewards.

In 2.2 brayfox because the dungeon people spammed for myth because it took the shortest amount of time to finish.

[Toodles]

They weren't hard but many people loved them b/c it's the closest we got... and it was taken away from us!!!

I want hard 4-man content so badly... especially if 24-man content is going to stay a joke as well.

[Danima]

@Nestama
I agree with u a 100%

@Zumi
U can not only count the New content as u said. The old content is still there and besides that, the "hard" content from the patches before becomes easy. There is plenty of stuff in theory. But practically even for the casuals its useless, because most of them are between ilvl 100-110, too. Even they are bored because they are overgeared. At least the ones i know.

SE needs to stop making Old gear useless. Its a shame, that if u become lvl 50 these days, u can almost skip ilvl 60, 70, 80 completely. They can work Right away ilvl 100-110 and in the meantime they get ilvl 90 stuff. This shortens the game extremly. They need to think more about the minimum ilvl a dungeon needs to be allowed to enter. The fact that u can earn seals much faster than a year ago is enough for New players to catch up imho.

Im not saying make everything harder, game is to easy. But it needs to balanced out more. It needs more of a lvling curve instead of jumps.

[Sapphic]

I for one would like to see 4-man dungeons on the difficulty level of Coil that are part of endgame progression with it's difficulty and loot. Put in accessories or upgrade items in those dungeons but with the kicker that they aren't completely spammable like current 4-mans. Either a short dungeon lockout (6 hrs) or entry items that need to be earned to enter them.

And I honestly never found old AK or Pharos all that difficult. They were really straightforward.

If they did, all we would see is posts on forums "demanding" it to be nerfed, or a "story mode" added XD

[Kaskel2000]

The biggest issue is the low Ilevel of new hard mode dungeons. So far they have been much lower than the current average ilvl. Im fully expecting 2.4 to be at most ilvl 90 when most of my fc who have been playing for 6 months are ilvl 100 plus. The only time we had a bit of difficulty was tam Tara on the last boss before we worked out the mechanics.