Challenging 4-Man Content Please

[Alukah]

Kill adds, feed banana.

Avoid red, jump in bubble.

Avoid twister, don't stand in a line.

Idk they're ridiculously simple in my opinion.

A great number of the Dungeon Bosses boil down to 2-3 simplistic procedures (with most having only a single mode or phase), even if you infuse them with statistical difficulty.

What's the difference between that and old pharos/ak? or any dungeon/raid? All bosses are pretty much the same, avoid aoes, kill adds and then switch to boss, if what you want is stricter DPS checks then ask specifically for that, but mechanics will always be the same.

Something people don't consider is the average ilvl of people back then before they nerfed those dungeons and the average ilvl of people now with the new dungeons, if back then you could outgear the dungeon this much most of those dps checks would have meant nothing, if they didn't nerf them right now they would be a faceroll, if any of the expert dungeons would have those dps checks they would still be a faceroll with everyone wearing i110.

So yeah, that statistical difficulty plays a bigger role than you think, any challenge will be killed by overgearing, just like how they ease up dated content by adding echo, which only increases your stats while keeping the mechanics intact.

[Toodles]

Statistical difficulty means more when more mechanics are at play (Siren).

It also means more when the mechanics themselves are relatively harder or more pressing (Demon Wall + Bees).

When mechanics are simple & few, statistical difficulty means far less.

Also those weren't examples of what I want per se, just a shout out to those who miss that sort of 'challenge'.

Trust me, I've done all this game's content with friends all stripped to the bare minimum, almost all the 4-man is still a joke for experienced MMO'rs.

Prenerf at minimum ilvl was adequate... post-nerf, heck no.

A strict ilvl sync wouldn't be enough for most of this game's 4-man content.

[Exstal]

Unless it drops gear better than Second Coil, it'll be done once and then never again. Unless they make it part of roulette, and DF with hard content would be incredibly frustrating.

[Aleczan]

Qarn makes my head explode. It is enough challenging for 4-person dungeon for me.

//saying this just because I've been having a lot of headaches from Qarn. LOL.

[Toodles]

Unless it drops gear better than Second Coil, it'll be done once and then never again. Unless they make it part of roulette, and DF with hard content would be incredibly frustrating.

Yes to a Roulette option & they should offer some kind of incentive (e.g. drops Dyeable Dungeon Gear variants).

Perhaps an Allied Seal bonus upon completion.

There are ways of making them repeatable, to an extent.

I mean, using your argument we shouldn't even have dungeons at all practically.

I definitely think the ilvl drops should be great precursory gear to the current end-game raid.

For instance, Ex dungeons now would drop i105.

[Exstal]

The argument is why make harder versions of dungeons that drop gear inferior to last patch's raid? Especially if you're going to have the easier version parallel to it? Hunts really inflated the item level so even having gear lower than basically free i110 is a step backwards. Not as much as the current D.O.A. dungeons they have now, but not much better.

[Toodles]

Ex versions *now*... like not 2.4 Ex Dungeons.

I think i105 is perfect related to current end-game raid ilvl.

[Exstal]

I would say it should be subject to loot lockout, as to prevent item level inflation, otherwise I have no qualms about it.

[Toodles]

Subjection to loot lockout could extend their useful life, I'm not opposed to it per se if that's what the ppl want.

[VahnValbosce]

Not a complaint, I just wish for harder 4-man content for fun (I enjoy being challenged, I know not everybody does).

I agree with this thread 100%, and would like to add that people should not be asking for content to become easier. Alot of it is very easy to begin with and "steam-rollable" content is not what Video Games are intended for in the first place...