"To Improve PvP game balance, the ability Cleric Stance will no longer be usable"

[Domira]

The worst part of this will just be nobody is going to want to play healer anymore. I've already joined plenty of games where there's a group of 8 dps and even though several had 50 healers unlocked they said they didn't want to heal and their group just ended up getting smoked. Now healers are going to be even less fun to play I can't imagine this type of situation will get any better.

They never wanted to play healer from the beginning then. The removal of CS does nothing to WHM/SCH who actually are focused on healing. Perhaps the people who are quitting would be better off playing a dps role, since that is the aspect they seem to enjoy more.

[Tridus1x]

So does this mean the whole seperate people due to Grand Company lore is important is thrown out the window?

The WHM clearly states that healers must have a balance between doing damage and healing. They took away the damage part, so I guess they don't really care about what the lore says anymore.

So how about that lift on GC restrictions between friends? Since lore is not an excuse anymore.

They never wanted to play healer from the beginning then. The removal of CS does nothing to WHM/SCH who actually are focused on healing. Perhaps the people who are quitting would be better off playing a dps role, since that is the aspect they seem to enjoy more.

I can see you never played healer, due to that response. The answer to your question is that healers are meant to do BOTH, since the game actually encourages you to play like that. Also since healers are getting +acc on their gear now, that further proves the fact we are meant to do damage. Don't worry though, when the two dragoons and monk can't kill a healer still, they'll nerf it so healers can't use heal spells until the enemy gives them the green light.

[Adrian74]

They never wanted to play healer from the beginning then. The removal of CS does nothing to WHM/SCH who actually are focused on healing. Perhaps the people who are quitting would be better off playing a dps role, since that is the aspect they seem to enjoy more.

For some of us, healing is not an art of only use cure, cure II, adloquim and over cures like that... For us healing is the art of the yin yang, of the balance, where you need to control both sides of the game, both aspects, it's funnier than a DPS because you don't only DPS, it is funnier than a 'plain healer' because you don't only heal.... Our work is to maintain everyone alive and help the group to kill the menaces faster, they won't kill faster if we just heal them.

This balance btw requires a great precision, analysis of the situation and your team, and good timings, it would be bad if you start to just use cleric stance and attack while your party is dying.... And it would be bad to just stay healing when you have clearly time for DPSing... Knowing when to use Cleric Stance and when to remove it was what made HEALING interesting, it is why I started to like healing in FFXIV (I hated healing in other games) And it is why I still have healers as 'half-mains' (Despite being all-arounder, healers have priority in gear among the other classes) and still using them in PvE, in PvP it was even more 'alive' feeling, because the battles were unpredictable thanks to the nature of PvP, now it is just going there and heal...

Honestly, to can use that aspect of healing in PvE, but not in PvP just because people whines about it is... Lame. Expect frontlines to have less healers now, at least the ones that liked to get fun with the class.

Once again, what it makes healing AWESOMELY FUNNY in FFXIV, in my honest opinion, is having to balance the damage and healing output, and knowing well when you can do this and when not, and the whole symbol of that art is Cleric Stance, deleting it in PvP is just wrong. Please Square Enix, take this in consideration and lower the damage of the skills instead if you think that's needed for 'balance'.

PS: I know there are super raid pro contents where you probably have to be 95% of the time healing healing healing healing healing healing, probably the reason I rarely go there as healer, for that I have other classes where even only DPS can be funnier than only healing, sometimes.

[DenebPunkin]

It's really that easy

That only works if you are against 2 healers at most where you can burn the one fast enuff. The minute you go against a group of healers, which is pretty much standard among the better PVPers you lose. I have yet to see a Healer lose 1v1, 1v2 battle against non healers. Healers have way too much advantages over all the other classes.
If you want to balance it you either allow a modified CS that prevents them from healing entirely while the stance is active or reduce the healing potency even more. SE elected to remove it entirely. I also think that the DPS classes should be able to use MP to sprint to counter the TP using healer sprints. As it stands, DPS are entirely useless in PVP. They have too many disadvantages against the other classes to be viable... and most likely the ones complaining the most about PVP imbalance are the DPS players.

[Domira]

They aren't meant to do both in pvp. Pve is different because without damage a healer would be much more difficult to level up than other classes. Pve =/=Pvp. They are totally different gameplay modes. The only thing the CS change does is weed out genuine pvp healers from dps minded players who were playing them. As far as further nerfs are concerned, I don't think anyone should have a easy time killing a healer 1v1, or 2v1 or maybe even 3v1. If one player could easily kill them, then their role in mass pvp will be nullified since a smart group of players will target the healer. If one player could kill them easily then imagine what would happen if two or three jumped on them at once? It would be extremely frustrating.

My perspective is the healer class is suppose to be sturdy as a tank in pvp, in fact in pvp I'd go as far as to say they are the tanks in pvp since players generally go for them first.

[Klive]

You mean, in PvP, in order to boost our team's damage... we will have to bring DPS classes/jobs?

MADNESS!

What is next? Tanks will be expected to help protect the healer?

Insanity I tell you.

[YuriRamona]

That only works if you are against 2 healers at most where you can burn the one fast enuff. The minute you go against a group of healers, which is pretty much standard among the better PVPers you lose. I have yet to see a Healer lose 1v1, 1v2 battle against non healers. Healers have way too much advantages over all the other classes.
If you want to balance it you either allow a modified CS that prevents them from healing entirely while the stance is active or reduce the healing potency even more. SE elected to remove it entirely. I also think that the DPS classes should be able to use MP to sprint to counter the TP using healer sprints. As it stands, DPS are entirely useless in PVP. They have too many disadvantages against the other classes to be viable... and most likely the ones complaining the most about PVP imbalance are the DPS players.

A healer will always lose to a competent DPS in a 1v1 battle if they don't run away to safety. The only exception is if the DPS is a BLM. You just never see this happen because it takes probably between 30-60 seconds to burn down a healer, and they can usually run to safety in that time.

If you mean that you're dying to a WHM in a 1v1 situation, then you're just plain bad. If you're dying to a SCH in 1v1 situation, that's to be expected.

There are plenty of other matchups where one job will win against the other: BRD > MNK/DRG/PLD/MRD > SMN > BLM.

SCH gets to win 1v1 matchups. So what? They are complete crap in party healing and their DPS abilities are slightly below that of MRD/PLD.

The reason why SCH Cleric is so dominant in Frontlines is because a vast majority of parties don't have more than one WHM. Medica II and Regen nullify the effect of Baned DoTs.

Players also pick fights with SCH when they find them alone (stealing outposts or in transit, etc). They think they have an easy win because they're up against a healer. They lose and almost always die, and so they go to places like this and complain because a supposed "healer" is actually dangerous.

You don't see the rest of the world complaining that MRD has, bar none, the most potent sub-10 second burn abilities of all classes. And they're supposed to be a tank. Is that somehow also unfair?

Healers and tanks deal with enough crap in PvE, where DPS roles skate buy even if they're grossly incompetent at their job (excluding encounters such as Coil and extreme Primals). Can't we have a little damage-dealing fun when we're in PvP?

Congratulations FFXIV community, for taking away other people's fun just because you're having slightly less of it.

[Adrian74]

I'll run out of posts per day just in this thread, but there are really awesome (And honestly, unexpected, because I expected the people who made SE to remove this to come here and whine) posts here. Like the last one made by YuriRamona.

+1.

Honestly, people can't see how much damage they do by whining just because something can be used better and kills them. Well, in PvE my first class was warrior, seems like it is going to be the one to go now to PvP, if I have yet the enough motivation to go there and, of course, before it gets also another nerf, maybe removing something important like berserk and skills like that.

[Shake0615]

What is next? Tanks will be expected to help protect the healer?

Let's get real. Can a healer rely on a paladin to cover them in PvP? Hell no.

[DenebPunkin]

A healer will always lose to a competent DPS in a 1v1 battle if they don't run away to safety.

This is gold. If they dont run away to safety... because WHY should a healer run away to safety right.. I mean clearly they dont wanna win anymore. DPS have a skill to heavy and remove sprint, but a healer can just throw their Invisi Shield up and regain enuff TP to sprint away again. A competent DPS against a Competent Healer results in the healer coming out victorious more often then not. This means one class has a clear advantage over the other. If you play SF thats like saying a competent player using Dan should be on equal footing with a competent player using Akuma... when Akuma has a 7-10 chance/percentage of steamrolling the Dan user. Competence only comes into play when the two characters are balanced and one does not clearly outweigh the other.