Ninja: Walk in shadow.

[JakzChurchill]

Don't get me wrong I've always understood that whether an attack is ranged or melee is unaffected by the differring stats, I've stated this a few times in this thread. But as you also mentioned it currently works on a weapon basis, your weapon is ranged use dex, if its melee use str. This system is very intuitive in its design, there is no questions as to the stat you should be stacking.

This is the basis of the argument against you, changing this design to allow one melee class to use the ranged stat defeats the purpose of this system, and as much as you try to argue it changing the tooltip to account for specific weapons will complicate everything they have put in place to make things so simple.

But I guess there's just a counter argument to every counter argument so we could go around in circles till 2.4. Probably best to abandon this as every point possible of being made on both sides by this point has been made.

[Jaykos]

Please let me know what you guys think, but before you do I suggest that you actually read the above text in full and make sure you understand. I may have worded some parts in a manner difficult to this request, but I would be happy to clarify in that case.

I think everything you posted was absolute rubbish and that ninja will use strength.

[NoctisUmbra]

I think everything you posted was absolute rubbish and that ninja will use strength.

Fantastic contribution!

This is the basis of the argument against you, changing this design to allow one melee class to use the ranged stat defeats the purpose of this system, and as much as you try to argue it changing the tooltip to account for specific weapons will complicate everything they have put in place to make things so simple.

I elaborated that since the beta change, that's not necessarily the design as far as STR and DEX go. The design is essentially "there are STR weapons and there are DEX weapons under the umbrella of physical weapons".

The fact of the matter is, if they stick with a definition like "STR is melee and DEX is ranged only" they will limit the DEX attribute considerably as something useful only for a handful of classes. The more traditional definition of STR being used for weapons based on force and DEX for weapons based on precision, ranged or not, will expand the attribute and allow for better itemization moving forward.

Furthermore, there are the other sources of info that have hints towards DEX as I suggested. Ultimately, only time will tell.

What we definitely know is they have been considering STR and DEX, so either of them are likely.

[RobbieH]

Ninja Speculation Doc

"Subjobs likely PGL and ARC."

Pugilist and Archer?

Seriously?

Aren't you (or whoever wrote that) forgetting something? I mean, Rogue it's the base class, can't be Pugilist and Archer = Ninja

[NoctisUmbra]

"Subjobs likely PGL and ARC."

Pugilist and Archer?

Seriously?

Aren't you (or whoever wrote that) forgetting something? I mean, Rogue it's the base class, can't be Pugilist and Archer = Ninja

Rogue + either PGL or ARC to unlock.
However all jobs can pull sub skills for 1 more class. So when they say likely subclasses, they are referring to the 2 classes the NIN job will be able to gain cross class skills from.

[JakzChurchill]

I elaborated that since the beta change, that's not necessarily the design as far as STR and DEX go. The design is essentially "there are STR weapons and there are DEX weapons under the umbrella of physical weapons".

The fact of the matter is, if they stick with a definition like "STR is melee and DEX is ranged only" they will limit the DEX attribute considerably as something useful only for a handful of classes. The more traditional definition of STR being used for weapons based on force and DEX for weapons based on precision, ranged or not, will expand the attribute and allow for better itemization moving forward.
.

I feel your completely misunderstanding the current stat system on the first point, it's not as you have described and you have infact negated the key point of this system, in that how a weapon attacks denotes it's stat. If you start separating by strength and precision your going to run into issues with class perception, is a monk not about precision? using quick low damage attacks and hitting specific areas to get a crit. So how would a newcomer to the game distinguish between monk and ninja, why is one inheritly about strength while the other precision when overall they share the same attack style. The current system stops this from ever being an issue.

I'll go a step further and say from all gameplay we'v seen so far, monk seems a lot more about precision than ninja, the fact that ninja's barely have to move to get attack bonuses shows this point. And you can't retroactively change monks stat to reflect this, it would change too much.

The change you talk about would of been great, if it was set up from the outset, if they had put the effort to have this clearly defined from the start with key ways to really show each classes stat, but making this change a year into the games lifespan changes too much to be feasible.

[Ejell]

The DEX or STR talk is useless, yoshi said even him did'nt know which one will be inplemented, and no-one could guess.
Please talk on things we can talk about (datamined passives (obviously not the dex ones) and the video).

This video is quite strange, immagine such a vid with the monk or drg, where the player randomly puts his combos, dance around and uses all of his skills...
Good luck to find any teamplay from it

(just to put oil on the fire, the french translation of "foe's requiem" clearly say it lowers the "elemental magic armor" of the targets (such as fire, thunder, water...) when the english one say it lowers magic armor.
Those are only words, which can be changed by SE as they want, to make it fit their needs, don't forget !)

[RobbieH]

Rogue + either PGL or ARC to unlock.
However all jobs can pull sub skills for 1 more class. So when they say likely subclasses, they are referring to the 2 classes the NIN job will be able to gain cross class skills from.

I see, i thought they mentioned the Classes needed to unlock, makes sense now, sorry ^^'

[Warrlordd]

My bets are on archer/drg but thats just a total speculation

[Cynric]

My bets are on archer/drg but thats just a total speculation

i doubt wed get increased tp regen and invigorate on the same class