Who is gonna raid now with the iLvl 110 gear handed to people??

[Brine_Gildchaff]

^ Apparently this concept was too hard to grasp.

Crying you can't be in raid gear without raiding.

Since when does soldiery gear count as "raid gear"? Raid gear is the High Allagan sets and the i115 weapons. Soldiery gear is like myth gear: the equal-level gear that non-raiders can get by putting in a significant portion of time and effort on other content instead of doing the raid for ~2 hours each week, and limited in how quickly someone can obtain it due to tomestone caps. In fact, it's -harder- to get and requires -more- time and effort than myth gear did because the lockout is lower and soldiery drops in smaller numbers than did myth, and you have to do two steps: soldiery grind for weathered, then hunt/SCoB/2.35 Syrcus grinding to get sands.

(And before you go whinging that people can get sands with zero effort, no they can't. I hunt. I make a party of eight and go scouring the zones, sometimes with one or two people getting info from their LS. My best run we went for 3~4 hours and I ended up with 350 seals by the end, and not a single log to show for it. And even if they could, they're -still- time locked because you need the base soldiery gear to -upgrade- no matter how many sands you get. I've been playing since the 2.2 patch came along and I've only failed to cap one week. I'm only -just- now starting to look at gearing up classes besides my main two. And that's -without- buying a single soldiery weapon, I have animus sword, novus shield, and a thyrus that's one final book away from animus status.)

I don't see what the problem is with having some cut-off to reward people for actually playing through end-game content.

We have that. It's called High Allagan gear (which is BiS for many slots and earns you instant respect from anyone who sees you have it) and even more noticeably, the High Allagan weapons. Even my hard-made Novus doesn't compare to High Allagan, and I've spent far, far more time and work on that than raiders do on Second Coil.

[Zarzak]

Since when does soldiery gear count as "raid gear"? Raid gear is the High Allagan sets and the i115 weapons.

Soldiery isn't. Soldiery + sand/oil is.

ilvl 110 = raid tier gear this isn't hard to figure out.

Good, glad to know its purely your own ego that's hurt. The higher stats aren't enough for you?

Mine? No I don't raid atm.

What higher stats? You get the same tier of gear if you sit in town and follow the <pos> calls.

[Brine_Gildchaff]

Soldiery isn't. Soldiery + sand/oil is.

ilvl 110 = raid tier gear this isn't hard to figure out.

Soldiery gear is not raid gear and never has been. Sands and oils were planned from the beginning to be available through routes other than Coil. Why are you complaining about having two MONTHS where you got to have this gear before everyone else? Or are you one of those strange people who complained that nobody would do Coil because people would just buy all myth gear back in 2.0/2.1?

What higher stats? You get the same tier of gear if you sit in town and follow the <pos> calls.

First off, no you don't. If you just sit idle until someone shouts and then you zone in and run to the mob, at -least- two times out of three you're going to get there just when the mob has finished dying. If you're not actively hunting with others you're not getting jack doodly sh**. Second, the majority of BiS gear is in fact High Allagan. Case in point: I looked through ariyala and chose my BiS gear for paladin and white mage. I currently require five sands -total- to upgrade them, and four oils (I've gotten one of each so far). Everything else I am going to have to fill in with High Allagan, supplementing with Syrcus gear until I can manage a raid. You do NOT have the best gear in the game purely by hunting.

[Zarzak]

First off, no you don't. If you just sit idle until someone shouts and then you zone in and run to the mob, at -least- two times out of three you're going to get there just when the mob has finished dying. If you're not actively hunting with others you're not getting jack doodly sh**.

LOL. If you say so. I'll continue to run around doing my animus book kills/leves (or sitting in town watching a movie) and porting wherever someone calls in linkshell and getting my kills. >2000 seals and 2 logs and counting.

Ah, so raiding is work, and everything else is not work, hmm?

You call others entitled, when you're the one who insists that only raiding should yield the best kind of loot. The very title of this thread speaks volumes about raiding and its enjoyability. If people wouldn't raid without the most massive carrot dangling on that stick, then perhaps raiding just isn't enjoyable enough to be a major part of games to begin with.

If people wouldn't raid without the most massive carrot dangling on that stick

So your saying raiding ISN'T the hardest content? Seems a lot of people are having trouble killing them but I haven't heard anyone complaining about being able to kill Brayflox Hard Mode.

Uhh.. The same way 99% people wouldn't do anything? If they stop paying you at work are you going to keep showing up? Or maybe a better comparison. If you learn the guy who mows your neighbors lawn in 30 minutes once a month is making more money than you are for working 40 hours a week. Are you going to keep working where your working? Or are you going to go mow your neighbors lawn for 30 minutes once a month?

[Riepah]

So your saying raiding ISN'T the hardest content? Seems a lot of people are having trouble killing them but I haven't heard anyone complaining about being able to kill Brayflox Hard Mode.

Uhh.. The same way 99% people wouldn't do anything? If they stop paying you at work are you going to keep showing up? Or maybe a better comparison. If you learn the guy who mows your neighbors lawn in 30 minutes once a month is making more money than you are for working 40 hours a week. Are you going to keep working where your working? Or are you going to go mow your neighbors lawn for 30 minutes once a month?

Maybe your problem is that you see it as work, instead of seeing it for what it is; a game. Why do you want them to give you enough incentive to persuade you to do something you don't enjoy, rather than just doing something you actually enjoy?

Also, raiding isn't that hard by itself. Finding 7 people who have the appropriate classes and whose schedule fits your own, 7 people who're actually reliable enough to show up on time, good enough players to do their part of the job right - that's more difficult than the raid itself.

You could be doing everything 100% right and perfectly, and the raid may still fail because other people mess up. That doesn't mean it's more difficult, though, it just means it's more frustrating.

[Dwill]

Soldiery gear is not raid gear and never has been. Sands and oils were planned from the beginning to be available through routes other than Coil. Why are you complaining about having two MONTHS where you got to have this gear before everyone else? Or are you one of those strange people who complained that nobody would do Coil because people would just buy all myth gear back in 2.0/2.1?

Except that it is. i110 High Allagan and i110 Geralt Masterworks both have the same iLvL and itemization budget, just different stats with i110 soldiery being better in quite a few cases. The only exception is the i115 weapons who by themselves don't justify the mass influx of sands going out.

[Dwill]

Since when does soldiery gear count as "raid gear"? Raid gear is the High Allagan sets and the i115 weapons. Soldiery gear is like myth gear: the equal-level gear that non-raiders can get by putting in a significant portion of time and effort on other content instead of doing the raid for ~2 hours each week, and limited in how quickly someone can obtain it due to tomestone caps. In fact, it's -harder- to get and requires -more- time and effort than myth gear did because the lockout is lower and soldiery drops in smaller numbers than did myth, and you have to do two steps: soldiery grind for weathered, then hunt/SCoB/2.35 Syrcus grinding to get sands.

(And before you go whinging that people can get sands with zero effort, no they can't. I hunt. I make a party of eight and go scouring the zones, sometimes with one or two people getting info from their LS. My best run we went for 3~4 hours and I ended up with 350 seals by the end, and not a single log to show for it. And even if they could, they're -still- time locked because you need the base soldiery gear to -upgrade- no matter how many sands you get. I've been playing since the 2.2 patch came along and I've only failed to cap one week. I'm only -just- now starting to look at gearing up classes besides my main two. And that's -without- buying a single soldiery weapon, I have animus sword, novus shield, and a thyrus that's one final book away from animus status.)



We have that. It's called High Allagan gear (which is BiS for many slots and earns you instant respect from anyone who sees you have it) and even more noticeably, the High Allagan weapons. Even my hard-made Novus doesn't compare to High Allagan, and I've spent far, far more time and work on that than raiders do on Second Coil.

Except that soldiery in i110 is the same as High Allagan with a different itemization, quite often being better for a lot of slots. The only real gain from SCoB is the High Allagan weapons and as it has been stated previously, one item does not justify the vast amount of sands being obtained via The Hunt.

Soldiery being a soft-cap as already been discussed as well, it's something that would made sense if they would have came out this patch. The thing is that plenty of people already have 1 job with nearly all, if not all the soldiery pieces therefore allowing for a good amount of sands to be used before soldiery can even be considered a cap (which is going to be never for people playing 1 or 2 jobs only).

The effort necessary for The Hunt is not even remotely close to the one needed to raid. It is time consuming but effortless. You can easily just park your character to an Aetheryte or at one of the few spawns point then go /afk until it spawns or even just /follow people around. You don't need to coordinate encounters, manage drops, manage the schedule of your static, getting the consumables for your raid night and so on. You just need a spreadsheet that's been built by someone else or a website that calculates the approximate time for you and zerg stuff until it dies.

I personally think that the game focuses too heavily on raiding as the main end game activity. As anyone can tell from trying EX primals, a lot of the gaming crowd doesn't respond well to these kinds of encounters. Does that mean they are casual? Hardly. Give them the right gaming experience and many of them will dedicate just as many hours to crafting, hunting, gathering, building, or mini-gaming as any raider applies to raiding. Trying to satisfy a small group of gamers who like one particular kind of activity with a product whose development budget suggests being created to satisfy many different kinds of gamers is a problem that I'm quite happy Yoshida is addressing.

You have around 3 hours of raiding a week in this game when you clear T9, that's it (that includes your static doing Syrcus Tower for Oils/Stones, else even less than 3). How is that even remotely close to too much ?

Casuals are already dedicating countless hours to everything you mentioned so I'm not even sure what kind of data/evidence you are using to back up such an exaggerated statement.

[Fendred]

Sometimes I just speak total nonsense. When that happens, please ignore me as much as possible.

On the upside, my character is adorable! Ignore the nonsense! Embrace the cuteness!