atma drop rates

[Gamma621]

Also: If you have something on paper that confirms "majority" or "most" for people who dislike it, fantastic. How about you share it with us.

It's funny that you ask for something on paper, when everything you've been preaching about atma drop rates has all been based on heresay and promises. Show me proof that you have 80+ atmas. Show me proof of exactly how many FATEs it took you to get those Atmas.

That is a personal problem...

How is that a personal problem? If a game isn't fun, then it's work, which you keep claiming atma farming is not. So just keep throwing random phrases at me instead of actually posing an argument.

Bad decision, not anyone else's fault.

No it wasn't a bad decision. I'm still going to play this game, because I still enjoy everything else about this game. I'm not quitting over this, I'm just trying to point out how stupid and blind you are for defending it, and how stupid Square Enix would be for not changing it.

These forums do not show proof of the majority...

Nope, but they help indicate how the community feels about issues like this, and is one of the few good outlets for people to express their concerns.

Your personal Preference in what a videogame is... Your Personal Preference... This is not a government conspiracy, or a real world problem like your making it out to be, Why am I sheep? I do not understand your logic on this subject...

I never said it was a government conspiracy. It's the downward spiral of the game industry, which I happen to care about, and which you are perpetuating. It's funny how you claim to care about this game, and that it is such a piece of art that it should be appreciated, yet you just blindly follow (Like a sheep since you can't pick up on the analogy) and tell Square Enix that everything is perfect. However, people like me and the others voicing their concerns, are actually attempting to help Square Enix improve their game and keep players coming back. So keep saying that it's fine until Square Enix ruins this game just like they ruined the last one, and nobody is playing anymore. Hope you enjoy farming your atmas on an empty server.

Unless you can pull figures somewhere else, then I will disagree with you.

Unless you can pull figures, then I disagree with you too. You guys are demanding a lot of evidence yet giving none yourself.

[dthmchnek]

How is that a personal problem? If a game isn't fun, then it's work, which you keep claiming atma farming is not. So just keep throwing random phrases at me instead of actually posing an argument.

Its a personal problem because what you find fun and not fun is friggin personal...

No it wasn't a bad decision. I'm still going to play this game, because I still enjoy everything else about this game. I'm not quitting over this, I'm just trying to point out how stupid and blind you are for defending it, and how stupid Square Enix would be for not changing it.

So I am blind because I do not think there is a problem with it, and you are the saving grace of square enix because you dislike it and want it to change. Its also cool to call the game you love so much "stupid".

Nope, but they help indicate how the community feels about issues like this, and is one of the few good outlets for people to express their concerns.

True. Ofcourse you aren't going to see the people who do like it or do not mind it come on the forums though.

I never said it was a government conspiracy. It's the downward spiral of the game industry, which I happen to care about, and which you are perpetuating. It's funny how you claim to care about this game, and that it is such a piece of art that it should be appreciated, yet you just blindly follow (Like a sheep since you can't pick up on the analogy) and tell Square Enix that everything is perfect. However, people like me and the others voicing their concerns, are actually attempting to help Square Enix improve their game and keep players coming back. So keep saying that it's fine until Square Enix ruins this game just like they ruined the last one, and nobody is playing anymore. Hope you enjoy farming your atmas on an empty server.

I never said you said it was a government conspiracy I was just trying to make an analogy to what scale you are trying to make this bit of content in the game be. I also never said that I cared about this game, say that is was "such" a piece of art, and tell Square Enix that everything is perfect... You think the fall of the industry is people making games that you, I say this again... personally dont like, and I am a sheep because I appreciate the work put into a game..., the story, the gameplay, the... whatever... I am beginning to not understand what you are saying any more... ofcourse I got the dumb analogy thats why I gave my analogy about the real world problem and government... never mind... just... I am not fluent in jack ass.

[Gamma621]

Its a personal problem because what you find fun and not fun is friggin personal...

Atma farming is hours upon hours of running between FATEs, requiring no thought whatsoever. However, looking at your replies, I can see why you would find it fun to not use your brain for an extended period of time.

So I am blind because I do not think there is a problem with it, and you are the saving grace of square enix because you dislike it and want it to change. Its also cool to call the game you love so much "stupid"

Giving constructive criticism in an attempt to improve the game =/= acknowledging myself as the saving grace of Square Enix. Also never once did I call this game stupid. I called the atma feature stupid, and I called Square Enix stupid for implementing it. Which, given their recent track record, is a valid statement.

True. Ofcourse you aren't going to see the people who do like it or do not mind it come on the forums though.

Except you apparently.

I never said you said it was a government conspiracy I was just trying to make an analogy to what scale you are trying to make this bit of content in the game be.

People are quitting over this. That kind of makes it a big deal.

I also never said that I cared about this game, say that is was "such" a piece of art, and tell Square Enix that everything is perfect...

These folks are putting so much work, art and design and you still have to pay only 60 dollars and a 12 dollar sub fee... Its always been like this, and it needs to be much more than what it used to be now. Pretty much the industry needs to die because people do not appreciate it anymore and complain instead.

Wanna try that again? Complaining about people who don't appreciate a game sounds like you do, in fact, care about it. And your entire argument is based around telling Square Enix that everything is perfect, since you're determined to defend this broken system.

You think the fall of the industry is people making games that you, I say this again... personally dont like, and I am a sheep because I appreciate the work put into a game..., the story, the gameplay, the... whatever...

No, you're a sheep because you want everyone to appreciate work, even when the work is bad. That's the definition of a fanboy. Blindly liking anything put out by Square Enix just because of who they are. If they put out a game, or a feature in a game that is disliked, they should be called out on it. Not just given a pass so they can keep repeating the mistake.

I am beginning to not understand what you are saying any more... ofcourse I got the dumb analogy thats why I gave my analogy about the real world problem and government...

This is not a government conspiracy, or a real world problem like your making it out to be, Why am I sheep? I do not understand your logic on this subject...

It's sad watching you try and backpedal to save yourself from looking stupid.

never mind... just... I am not fluent in jack ass.

Considering the way you type, it doesn't sound like you're fluent in anything. And through all of your pointless rambling, you've yet to give a single example of why this Atma system is good, and should be kept. All you've said so far is "Deal with it."

[dthmchnek]

Wanna try that again? Complaining about people who don't appreciate a game sounds like you do, in fact, care about it. And your entire argument is based around telling Square Enix that everything is perfect, since you're determined to defend this broken system.

No, you're a sheep because you want everyone to appreciate work, even when the work is bad. That's the definition of a fanboy. Blindly liking anything put out by Square Enix just because of who they are. If they put out a game, or a feature in a game that is disliked, they should be called out on it. Not just given a pass so they can keep repeating the mistake.

Okay... let me try this again, These(as in every developer out there including Square Enix, yes) are putting so much work(The amount of people that they need to hire and the teams put together incredibly outweighs what they needed in the past), art(The equipment needed to make the art, the computer hardware needed to produce the level design, character design, etc.) design(The planning, meetings on how things will work, how much crap they do scrap because they dont think its a good idea). It needs to cost more because of those reasons, I think. And people lose their crap when something doesn't go their way when its just a video game, and complain about it. I despise FFXIII, but others do enjoy the hell out of it, Do I go around belittling them because they like something that I do not like? Nope...

I never said the system was good and fun, I just do not have a problem with it.
I never said to "deal with it", but I am saying that you are just making this game out to be about "Work" because your complaining about it and you think you "have" to do atma farming, like SE is forcing you to do it.

I have expressed no fanboyism here... you are just making me out to be one because i just don't have a problem with the atma system... which is blasphemy, I get it... I will agree to disagree.

[Gamma621]

Okay... let me try this again, These(as in every developer out there including Square Enix, yes) are putting so much work(The amount of people that they need to hire and the teams put together incredibly outweighs what they needed in the past), art(The equipment needed to make the art, the computer hardware needed to produce the level design, character design, etc.) design(The planning, meetings on how things will work, how much crap they do scrap because they dont think its a good idea). It needs to cost more because of those reasons, I think. And people lose their crap when something doesn't go their way when its just a video game, and complain about it.

Duke Nukem Forever must be your favorite game of all time, cause they spent 15 years of work on that, and look how great that game is.


No Man's Sky was created by a team of less than 10 people, and it already looks better than most big budget, mainstream developer games. So tell me again how you need so many people and a huge budget to make a game worth appreciating.

I despise FFXIII, but others do enjoy the hell out of it, Do I go around belittling them because they like something that I do not like? Nope...

You're belittling people right now for not liking the atma system.

I never said the system was good and fun, I just do not have a problem with it.
I never said to "deal with it", but I am saying that you are just making this game out to be about "Work" because your complaining about it and you think you "have" to do atma farming, like SE is forcing you to do it.

And the backpedaling continues. Maybe I can get you to actually admit that you don't like the atma system if I go long enough.

I have expressed no fanboyism here... you are just making me out to be one because i just don't have a problem with the atma system... which is blasphemy, I get it... I will agree to disagree.

The very fact that you feel the need the defend a system that you claim not to like just screams fanboy. There's literally no other reason for you to be responding in these threads otherwise.

You or I could have farmed 1, maybe even 2 Atma, in the time it took you to formulate this argument. Well done.

Its like this:

Oh look! You dismissed my data because you have no argument for it, just like I knew you would. And it took me less than 30 minutes to look through your achievement list and do some basic math. I could have done that 7 more times before getting a single atma. (Actually more like 17 more times since I've already farmed for 9 hours without a drop.)

You asked me for data, I gave it. I even used your own personal experience as an example. Yet you still have no response disproving my numbers, in fact you've basically confirmed them by not even denying how much you time you spent farming.

So I thank you in your assistance in proving how broken this system is.

[Duuude007]

You asked me for data, I deflected by attacking your data.

I know you did. This is why my response was not grateful, because it wasn't even what I had asked for, far from it.

And so, said "majority" claims remain a claim of yours, hearsay if you will, without sufficient supporting data.

You know, the one thing I requested in the first place.

[Gamma621]

I know you did. This is why my response was not grateful, because it wasn't even what I had asked for, far from it.

And so, said "majority" claims remain a claim of yours, hearsay if you will, without sufficient supporting data.

You know, the one thing I requested in the first place.

Then why shouldn't I ask you for data to the contrary? Give me proof that the majority DOES approve of atma farming? You are making these claims just as I am. We both know that it is a ridiculous request that neither of us could complete, and you're just using it as a stall tactic because you have no argument.

And you still have not even answered MY original question, how many FATEs it required to gain 91 atma. It should not be a hard question, I figured it out for you in less than 30 minutes. And you still refuse to answer because you don't want people to know how many hours you've actually wasted on this feature.

And I still have not heard one valid example as to why this atma system is good, and should be kept. All I've heard from the defenders is to stop complaining, without a single reason why we should.

[Duuude007]

It's funny that you ask for something on paper, when everything you've been preaching about atma drop rates has all been based on heresay and promises. Show me proof that you have 80+ atmas. Show me proof of exactly how many FATEs it took you to get those Atmas.

What preaching, what hearsay, what promises? In what context?

Fine, I'll answer your demands first, as an act of good faith that you will respond in kind.

Demonstrating my Atma count is simple.

12- Curtana Animus, Holy Shield Animus
24- Thyrus Atma
36- Omnilex Atma
48- Veil of Wiyu Atma
60 - Undeclared set
72 - Undeclared set #2
84 - Undeclared set #3
91 - Undeclared partial set (7/12)

As for How many fates I have done, I have already achieved 3000 fates achievement, as seen in lodestone. So my persistence is neither applicable nor relevant.

In contrast, you have left your profile achievements hidden to hide what you have truly done in FFXIV, but no matter.

So! I shared with you what evidence I have And I feel that my response was quite thorough. Are you prepared yet to share your evidence about said majority of players?

Hint: No forum posts thus far have what you are looking for, as it is not truly representative of the FFXIV playerbase. Merely the most vocal.

[Gamma621]

What preaching, what hearsay, what promises? In what context?

Fine, I'll answer your demands first, as an act of good faith that you will respond in kind.

Demonstrating my Atma count is simple.

12- Curtana Animus, Holy Shield Animus
24- Thyrus Atma
36- Omnilex Atma
48- Veil of Wiyu Atma
60 - Undeclared set
72 - Undeclared set #2
84 - Undeclared set #3
91 - Undeclared partial set (7/12)

As for How many fates I have done, I have already achieved 3000 fates achievement, as seen in lodestone. So my persistence is neither applicable nor relevant.

In contrast, you have left your profile achievements hidden to hide what you have truly done in FFXIV, but no matter.

So! I shared with you what evidence I have And I feel that my response was quite thorough. Are you prepared yet to share your evidence about said majority of players?

Hint: No forum posts thus far have what you are looking for, as it is not truly representative of the FFXIV playerbase. Merely the most vocal.

Asking me for data and then forbidding me from using the only data I have available...that's very convenient for you. Regardless, I'm not going to wade through the entire internet and tally up every negative forum post that I can find about atma farming, just to have you dismiss it anyways.

Also accusing me of hiding my achievements, when the fact is I never bothered to set up my Lodestone profile in the first place. I have now opened my achievements to the public, so go ahead and dig through them to your heart's content and see exactly what I've been hiding.

Thank you for providing evidence of your acquired atma stones, but yet still brushing off my request for evidence of how long it took you to obtain them. Now, in an attempt to be as thorough as you think your response of 2 pictures and accusations was, I will try to extrapolate my own evidence based on what little data I have to work with.

I took the liberty of looking over your Lodestone profile after you mentioned it, and as you said, you unlocked the "Successfully complete 3,000 FATEs" achievement on 05/19/2014. You also unlocked the "Successfully complete 1,000 FATEs" achievement on 04/26/2014. Since it does not tell me at what time of day these achievements were unlocked, this could be between 22 and 24 days to complete 2,000 FATEs. (I will use 23 days as an average.)

2,000 FATEs/23 days=86.956522 FATEs per day (I will round to 87 to make the math easier.)

Now, depending on the size of the map, Type of FATE, transit time, and respawn timers of the FATEs, let's say you could successfully complete a FATE every 5 minutes. That means you would be able to complete 12 FATEs every hour. It would take you approximately 7.25 hours of FATE grinding every day to achieve this. Not allowing for any breaks during the farming session of course.

Between your latest achievement on 05/19/2014, and present day, (~24 days) you could have easily done another 2,000 FATEs, if not more, since you clearly have been farming atmas.

Also the time between your achievement on 04/26/2014, and the day atma was released, you completed anywhere between 1, or 700 FATEs since your "Successfully complete 300 FATEs" achievement was completed prior to release of atma. So I will again have to take the average of 350 FATEs for those days.

Estimated 4,350 FATEs/91 atma=average of 47.8021 FATEs/per atma drop
This equates to 3.98 hours of farming, again assuming 1 FATE is completed every 5 minutes, and no breaks are taken. (And I think I'm being pretty generous with the 5 minutes.)

It has been approximately 77 days since atma was integrated. Let's take the time required to obtain all of your atmas, and spread them evenly over those days.

91 atma/77 days=1.1818 atma/day multiplied by 3.98 hours/atma=4.7 hours per day of farming.

Think about this number for a second. A person would have to spend an average of 4.7 hours farming FATEs EVERY DAY SINCE RELEASE and still would not have a complete weapon set.

Now let's look at your case. Considering you barely farmed FATEs at all for the entire first month, this means you farmed OVER 7 HOURS EVERY SINGLE DAY to get where you are right now, and you're still not even done. And this does not even include the absurd amount of myths tomes required after getting every atma, which will also need to be farmed.

Furthermore, this data only applies to you since the RNG makes all of it not applicable for every other player on the game. So tell me again how, in the best case scenario, farming for 5 hours every day for over 3 months to get every weapon is an acceptable system.

In conclusion, the only thing we've proven here today is that you clearly have no life, and only farm atma so you can brag about having the most and feel like you accomplished something, when you've really accomplished nothing.

Was that response thorough enough for you?

[Duuude007]

snip

You or I could have farmed 1, maybe even 2 Atma, in the time it took you to formulate this argument. Well done.

Its like this:

in 2000 fates, you have this many Atma (grabs 65 straws) So, to get this many more, (grabs 26 more straws) and put them together...

Yeah, it seems I am grasping at a lot of straws here.