Let's talk about PvP

[Demacia]

PvP does ruin the PvE aspect -- If the PvP becomes a decent way to progress in any form guess what people will want to do mostly? It happens in every MMO that has a good PvP system.

I prefer no PvP but if it has to be implemented, a PvP system like Ballista; As in something completely optional and out of the way.



Let's take a look at FPSs real quick:

What do people spend the majority of their time on? The campaign(PvE) or the multiplayer pvp aspect?

If you say campaign you're lying to yourself.

Right, what will people who play FPS spend the majority of their time on? A campaign, which no matter how long or how well made it is will be 100% cleared eventually, or multiplayer which has infinite replay value?

At least try to come up with a decent argument. We're talking about an MMO here. Even if PvP becomes a decent way to progress, SO WHAT? No fun allowed in XIV? If they can almost get it right in XI why not perfect it in XIV?

[Jennestia]

Right, what will people who play FPS spend the majority of their time on? A campaign, which no matter how long or how well made it is will be 100% cleared eventually, or multiplayer which has infinite replay value?

Actually, well made FPS has a campaign with replay value in order to get "100% completion". Most FPS these days have campaigns that are generally completely optional because their focus is on the Multiplayer. You're just adamant in believing people wouldn't choose PvP over PvE which you know deep down is a lie.

You're the one who hasn't come up with a "decent argument" as to why you believe PvP wouldn't overtake PvE like it does in most MMOs -- especially if PvP is lucrative.

[Demacia]

Actually, well made FPS has a campaign with replay value in order to get "100% completion". Most FPS these days have campaigns that are generally completely optional because their focus is on the Multiplayer. You're just adamant in believing people wouldn't choose PvP over PvE which you know deep down is a lie.

You're the one who hasn't come up with a "decent argument" as to why you believe PvP wouldn't overtake PvE like it does in most MMOs -- especially if PvP is lucrative.

Great, but how often will you replay the same campaign before you get bored as opposed to multiplayer where you can go against real people instead of the AI and maps you've completely memorized? The difference is that the single-player experience in ANY game will be LIMITED while the multiplayer experience is NOT.

So you're afraid of people spending too much time having fun in PvP than grinding mobs in PvE? Fine, make it so you can't really level up from PvP and give cosmetic/material rewards. I'm adamant in believing that people should have the option to play against each other in a massively multiplayer game. PvE comes first, but PvP should always be available.

[Eekiki]

Great, but how often will you replay the same campaign before you get bored as opposed to multiplayer where you can go against real people instead of the AI and maps you've completely memorized? The difference is that the single-player experience in ANY game will be LIMITED while the multiplayer experience is NOT.

That's a very good point, but why play BioShock 2 or F.3.A.R.'s multiplayer, when you could play Team Fortress 2 or Counter Strike? Fantastic multiplayer FPS's with no single-player campaign. Remember Counter-Strike: Condition Zero? A single-player campaign for Counter Strike. And it sucked.

Likewise, you have Guild Wars, an online RPG with a heavy focus on PvP. And it's great. And I think Guild Wars 2 is going to suck, because they're trying to do too much at once.

This is a general philosophy I've been thinking of lately. I think a lot of things in this world are getting too complicated. Things need to be simplified. That's why I threw away my ridiculous 5 blade fusion razor and bought a good double-edged safety blade. Thanks to that I've got the best shave I've ever had.

[Demacia]

That's a very good point, but why play BioShock 2 or F.3.A.R.'s multiplayer, when you could play Team Fortress 2 or Counter Strike? Fantastic multiplayer FPS's with no single-player campaign. Remember Counter-Strike: Condition Zero? A single-player campaign for Counter Strike. And it sucked.

Likewise, you have Guild Wars, an online RPG with a heavy focus on PvP. And it's great. And I think Guild Wars 2 is going to suck, because they're trying to do too much at once.

This is a general philosophy I've been thinking of lately. I think a lot of things in this world are getting too complicated. Things need to be simplified. That's why I threw away my ridiculous 5 blade fusion razor and bought a good double-edged safety blade. Thanks to that I've got the best shave I've ever had.

Well, here's the thing and once again I'll be using FFXI as an example: I like FFXI as it's both visually appealing and the combat system, to me, is enjoyable. I like the job system, the variety that subjobs provide, and the unique aspects and abilities of all the different jobs and weapons. I played GW and WoW, but found them both boring, ugly, and just dull in general. Even if GW and WoW had way better PvP than FFXI, I still prefer FFXI's PvP because I prefer FFXI over the other two in general. I wanted to fight against other players and formulate new builds and strategies based around FFXI's combat system and job system, so assuming FFXIV ever becomes a great game, I would like to be able to do the same thing.

And that is to slap people around on my Pugilist using completely different strategies than I would in PvE, since this time I'd have to actually outsmart/outplay a human being.

[Eekiki]

Well, here's the thing and once again I'll be using FFXI as an example: I like FFXI as it's both visually appealing and the combat system, to me, is enjoyable. I like the job system, the variety that subjobs provide, and the unique aspects and abilities of all the different jobs and weapons. I played GW and WoW, but found them both boring, ugly, and just dull in general. Even if GW and WoW had way better PvP than FFXI, I still prefer FFXI's PvP because I prefer FFXI over the other two in general. I wanted to fight against other players and formulate new builds and strategies based around FFXI's combat system and job system, so assuming FFXIV ever becomes a great game, I would like to be able to do the same thing.

And that is to slap people around on my Pugilist using completely different strategies than I would in PvE, since this time I'd have to actually outsmart/outplay a human being.

This makes a lot of sense.

"assuming FFXIV ever becomes a great game" ...that's a big "if". ^_^