I am getting irritated with Summoner in endgame content

[Alcyon1]

2 SMN's is going to kill those adds very fast too, maybe not as fast, but fast enough to easily finish the job.

1SMN + 1BLM will kills the adds faster than 2 SMN or 2 BLM.

[Craiger]

1SMN + 1BLM will kills the adds faster than 2 SMN or 2 BLM.

Yeah, you are right.

OP, there are no jobs in the game right now, that isn't good in it's own way. There is nothing wrong with SMN's AoE, or single target dps for that matter. I suggest reading/watching guides on it, there are some good posts on this forum about it.

[Madoka]

Same story with Titan egis. You will not have a chance to apply your full DoTs before I have flared them twice (including Titan) and lined up my 3rd flare for the finisher.

I use RS and drop dots on titan right after he comes down from heart. OT moves the egis, I give them a second for hate and slap bane.

Also for your parsing it doesn't look like you're adding the SMN and Garuda together. Also just as there are bad BLM, there are also bad SMNs.

[Hitome]

Why are you rambling about who's best ? I simply said that SMN is up there with BLM in AoE sometimes.... Not better. And Maybe if both play at their best (how do I know your SMN's does that ?), BLM is on top, but it's not like it is a big problem....

Nope this is what you said:

As a SMN and BLM player, I can say that BLM isn't a "better option" in any way. In fact I think it's the other way around

Glad we cleared that up.

The OP was saying that BLM is better in every way, which certainly isn't true... They might be better at AoE, but SMN surely beats them in single target dps, so both are good. So no point in arguing who's best.

The OP was saying that he finds SMN annoying and that rolling BLM would be easier: not that one was better than the other. He also said BLM AoE DPS is superior. This is a fact. Not sure why we are even having this debate.

SMNs run circles around BLMs when they are able to multidot targets far apart and when movement is involved. Otherwise, SMN AoE is meh (better than the other classes) and their single target is adequate.

However, if there is no movement (turn 4), SMN will be about equal to a BLM. Your single target rotation doesn't have the PPS that the BLM rotation does. For every other fight with movement, your statement is correct.

1SMN + 1BLM will kills the adds faster than 2 SMN or 2 BLM.

Indeed. I like this combination the best. Just thought I'd correct some misconceptions..namely, BLM AoE DPS on turn 4 being superior and AoE dps on egis being superior. The rest of Titan favors SMNs quite a bit.

I use RS and drop dots on titan right after he comes down from heart. OT moves the egis, I give them a second for hate and slap bane.

Also for your parsing it doesn't look like you're adding the SMN and Garuda together. Also just as there are bad BLM, there are also bad SMNs.

First parse: SMN + egi = 19% damage
Second parse: SMn + egi = 13% + 5% = 18%

You can pop RS, sure. The question is: does it last long enough for your DoTs (at least bio 1) to tick? No, because 3 flares + the other two DPS beating on it = dead egis within 15 seconds.

I agree with your second statement.

Which ties into the OP: SMNs do just fine. Learning the tricks of the trade are something you are just going to have to deal with or reroll a BLM. An amazing SMN can be quite a fun thing to play compared to the alternative you're considering (BLM).

[Viridiana]

You can pop RS, sure. The question is: does it last long enough for your DoTs (at least bio 1) to tick? No, because 3 flares + the other two DPS beating on it = dead egis within 15 seconds.

Huh? 15 seconds is almost the full duration of Bio. That's enough time for 550 potency (660 with RS) worth of dots to hit all 3 targets, not counting Garuda or what the SMN continues casting in those 15 seconds. I mean, yeah, Flare is powerful and all, but to say that 660 potency of dots is completely outshone by the other DPS seems a bit disingenuous. . .

[Ryuko]

My favorite job is SMN, but I will be the first to admit that both SMN + BLM have their benefits in different situations. Why anyone is even arguing about it baffles me. Look at each fight and think about each mechanic and phase of that fight. Ifrit extreme, for example, SMN dps tends to be better on Ifrit himself because there is a lot of dodging, but BLM tends to be better on the nails because there's no real 'build up' time for their nukes (and Bane will only hit so many nails at once). Summoner is excellent on Titan Extreme because you can Bane and Fester all the things. BLM really shines during quick burst moments, like Superbombs. Both jobs, when played correctly, have their merit. Perhaps they are not equal when it comes to a particular PHASE of the fight, but they are equal when it comes to the overall fight as a whole.

But anyway... not sure if anyone mentioned this, but to fix the issue of your pet dying...

1) In situations where lots of predictable AoEs occur, place your pet somewhere safe. If there is no certain spot to place your pet, just keep an eye on it. Make sure its HP doesn't fall too low. Keep in mind that Medica II regen WILL hit pets, and heal them.
2) Sustain is super useful. I don't know why I don't see more summoners use it. Sustain and placement is how I keep my pet alive 100% of the time in Ifrit Extreme and I've yet to see another summoner do that. I prefer saving swiftcast for Shadowflare, or Raise if I see someone is a weak link. I usually use sustain while dash is happening, so zero time is wasted.

Get in the habit of being mindful of your pet. You are, after all, a summoner. People complain that the Egi damage is too low compared to the master, but without Garuda-Egi, you won't have Contagion... which affects your OWN dps. You also won't have Rouse/Spur/Enkindle (more burst) or constant 'on the move' damage that just automatically happens without you having to do anything.

[jars]

I really doubt you can cast flare faster than I can bane my dots to the two egis.

and like I said your damage is INFLATED by the first pack of spiders which blm can spam flare on but summoner isn't going to bother expanding any real resources on killing. there is only one other aoe pull like that that actually matters(which summoner still does fine on with enkindle+ariel slash doing close to 600 potency), everything else is going to take more damage from summoner cleave than blm single target.

[Maelwys]

and like I said your damage is INFLATED by the first pack of spiders which blm can spam flare on but summoner isn't going to bother expanding any real resources on killing.

I wouldn't worry too much, it tends to balance out.

Dropping Shadowflare on those spiders counts for a fair bit, and you can always use Bane to spread your DoTs to the Knights... trying a Flare or three on a Soldier is usually not going to end very well due to reflective stoneskins. One of the better strategies for P5 involves bunching everything behind the dreadnought and bane-ing everything, then popping the AoE LB when they're low enough = clean slate going into P6

[Ryuko]

Anyone who is judging overall DPS by looking at Turn 4 is silly. The phases are extremely diverse.

For SMN in Turn 4, here is what I do (summoners will vary):

Phase 1: Target shadowflare, follow tank in as he pulls, immediately cast shadowflare (not SC) as the bugs gather. DoT up the left-most mob, Bane. DoT up the right-most mob, Bane. Miasma II. Fester on something with high HP to waste your last Aethercharge, then Aetherflow so it is ready for the next phase. Blizzard II spam until most things are dead, then single target mobs with the most HP.
Phase 2: DoT up the first soldier, Contagion, SC Shadowflare, Bane (so no time is wasted). Switch to other soldier, DoT up... Bane. Nuke nuke nuke. DoT up again... Bane. Use Aetherflow to get your charges back for the next phase. Be sure to position Garuda near where the dreadnaught will spawn so you will have the spiders fed immediately.
Phase 3: RS + 3 DoTs, Fester. Miasma II, Contagion (while casting shadowflare... or SC+Shadowflare if your group is fast enough). Nuke nuke nuke... Fester, Energy Drain (while RS is still active). Aetherflow to replenish your charges. Rouse+Spur+Enkindle as this is the strictest dps race in the fight. Possibly use a few more Festers (if they are ready) before the phase is over. Don't forget 100% DoT uptime.
Phase 4: Follow tank that is taking the spiders (OT usually) and stand on top of them so they can AoE aggro them. Follow a similar strategy to Phase 1... DoT up one side, Bane. DoT up another side, Bane. Miasma II and Shadowflare for added damage, and Blizzard II spam for more AoE.

Note: This next part is where many groups differ. I'll be referring to how my group does it. We usually win right as the soft enrage hits.

Phase 5: DoT up the soldier, Contagion. Bane. SC + Shadowflare. Kill Soldier, switch to the dreadnaught. Nuke as usual until next phase...
Phase 6: This phase spawns another dreadnaught, a soldier + knight pair, a rook, and two spiders. As a caster with an instant cast (Ruin 2) I take it upon myself to grab at least one spider so that I can bring it straight to the tank. A bard usually grabs the other. The melee gets on the rook and limit breaks it (if we have limit break), while the rest of us finish it off. Use your usual dot rotation and Fester. Then, switch to the 'old' dreadnaught (should be between 50% and 75% HP by the time you start on it again). Go hard on this part -- RS if it's up, follow a similar rotation to what I said to do in phase 3 if you have the cooldowns for it. After the old dreadnaught is down, switch to the soldier + knight pair. DoT up the soldier and Bane as you did in phases 2+5. At this point, you have the option of finishing off the soldier and throwing off supplementary heals, or switching to the spiders and trying to down them so the end of the phase is easier. If your group has gotten to this point, it really doesn't matter. After everything but the spiders are dead, stack on the remaining dreadnaught's butt (remember to position garuda here too so she gets AoE heals) and do your full, hard dps rotation until the end of the phase.

Defensive cooldowns: Virus is really nice during phases that are really hard on the healers, such as when there are two dreadnaughts at once. Make sure the 'immunity' debuff is not on a dreadnaught when you use it. Eye for an Eye is also great for these moments... feel free to toss it on a tank.

Every summoner is different. I have found this to work for me, and my group. You'll find summoners nitpicking what I do, but don't let that distract from the general strategy of what every summoner should be doing.

[Madoka]

For me it's similar, but I use cooldowns at different times.

Phase 1: I cast shadow flare where we're standing at the start, since our OT usually brings the spiders to us. Drop dots, Bane, wind blade, tab and find whoever didn't get baned and drop bio2 and bio on it, tab to the last one, drop all 3 and fester it to get its HP down with the rest, use Miasma 2 once, aetherflow and blizz2 two-three times and start moving into position for phase 2 since the spiders are either dead or nearly dead.

Phase 2: Drop my dots on the left soldier, fester and set Garuda on it, Drop my dots on the right soldier, contagion, fester and Bane onto that knight. Switch back to the first soldier and Ruin til its down or nearly down, go back to the other one and keep ruining. Use aetherflow when it's ready and move behind where the dreadnaught spawns and heel garuda

Phase 3: Cast 3 dots and Miasma 2 and Contagion the dread, ruin and fester til dead, use aetherflow when it's off CD again. I don't use any cooldowns here since my group is good enough to not need to, but in PUGs I used to use RS here.

Phase 4: I start on the further away Rook then fester and bane it. Shadow Flare and Miasma 2 when they're grouped up since the placement isnt always perfect, after that I do what I did in T1 and tab around to drop at least 2 dots on whatever didn't get the main 3 and I use rouse, spur and enkindle with Garuda then a wind blade after. Ruin everything, get the rooks down first of course.

Phase 5: I pop RS and use a mega-int potion and drop 3 main dots on the dread, contagion and fester, target soldier and drop 3 dots on it and bane. Typically our BLM doesn't attack this soldier for whatever reason but I get it down while the OT and melee kills the knight so the OT isn't overwhelmed in the next phase.

Phase 6: I've likely refreshed dots on the dread by now and Bane off it onto the other dread and rook, then i fester and ruin the rook and set Garuda on it. Once it's down if the 2nd dread isn't dead yet I go back to it. If it is I drop dots on the third dread and contagion and switch to the soldier, drop dots, bane and kill it. Again our blm doesn't usually attack this soldier but usually by the time I'm done with it the last dread is nearly dead from the other 3 DPS being on it and I've never hit soft enrage with this group. We also tend to feed one spider to the last dread and the OT keeps another, but sometimes a spider will go for someone randomly so the OT will grab it too

I'm I89 and the others in our group are all within the range of i85-i90 and whenever they do parse I usually have the highest damage totals by a few thousand after adding Garuda + me. Even in T4. By myself I usually do less damage than everyone but our bard, but our bard is also really good with Ballad and Foes which is the only reason that happens. Our MNK is always the highest stand alone, and usually right behind me after adding Garuda with BLM using being 2nd. Some fights I'll be above him stand alone, but thats just because of fight mechanics like Titan Ex