Gridanian Religion vs Reality: How much do the Hearers really hear?

[RickiFake02]

Yes! It has been stated over and over again that the elementals were incredibly weakened by the Calamity, and THAT is why they have been so absent in 2.0. That is why the poachers get away with poaching and that is why the Garleans have been able to set up their base without being blasted into oblivion. The elementals are simply too weak at this point to defend the Shroud like they used to.

[FJerome]

Correct me if I'm wrong but haven't the Keepers-of-the-Moon also been in the Black Shroud for generations?

"Their tradition of hunting in the thick woodlands of the Black Shroud have for years thrown them into conflict with the forestfolk of Gridania, who condemn them as poachers."

The non-Gridanian Moon-Keepers see their hunting as "tradition". The Gridanians see it as "poaching".

The elementals can't be too bothered about it since it seems that the Moon-Keepers have managed to stick around for years, long before the Calamity happened.

Actual serious question for the Legacy Players - has anyone ever seen a male Moon-Keeper in Gridania? I've only seen adult females, which makes it feel like only individuals are settling rather than family groups, otherwise you'd expect to see at least one or two adult males.

[Enkidoh]

'Years' doesn't necessarily mean generations though - 1.0 did show small groups of Moonkeeper poachers hunting illegally in the Shroud though, but they were rather thinly spread at best (and in fact, a lot of Gridanian 1.0 battlecraft levequests involved hunting them down and 'bringing them to justice' - that is, killing them).

And male miqo'te were never seen in 1.0 - neither as player-selectable or as npcs. ARR was the first taste we got of you. In fact, I still remember the stir on the Alpha forums after everyone saw the male miqo'te sitting in the corner at Buscarron's Druthers - he was literally our first glimpse of a male miqo'te of either clan in the game! It's unclear whether he really is a Moonkeeper or a Sunseeker though (he's unnamed, and has his back turned to the camera), but I'm liable to think he's a Moonkeeper.

A FATE in the South Shroud called 'the Coreul King' also involves having to fight a male Moonkeeper poacher who has set himself up as the Coreul King of the FATE's title (he's attended by a whole group of female Moonkeeper concubines), as well as regular Moonkeeper girl poachers. Other than that though, I haven't seen any other male Moonkeeper npcs at all in Gridania.

[Viridiana]

'Years' doesn't necessarily mean generations though - 1.0 did show small groups of Moonkeeper poachers hunting illegally in the Shroud though, but they were rather thinly spread at best (and in fact, a lot of Gridanian 1.0 battlecraft levequests involved hunting them down and 'bringing them to justice' - that is, killing them).

But it's hardly a tradition if it's only been going on for 5 years. Not for an entire race, anyway. Besides:

Before the Keepers of the Moon conceived of archery, they dwelt not in the city, but the forest. For my people, hunting was a way of life.

That certainly sounds like generations to me. Source is the level 10 ARC quest.

[Haprimac]

In fact, I still remember the stir on the Alpha forums after everyone saw the male miqo'te sitting in the corner at Buscarron's Druthers - he was literally our first glimpse of a male miqo'te of either clan in the game! It's unclear whether he really is a Moonkeeper or a Sunseeker though (he's unnamed, and has his back turned to the camera), but I'm liable to think he's a Moonkeeper.

He has a sunseeker's eyes. Probably an outcast tia or something. At least he seems pretty depressed with the dozen empty bottles on his table and how he grumbles "leave me be", when you get close to him.

[Empressia]

Yes! It has been stated over and over again that the elementals were incredibly weakened by the Calamity, and THAT is why they have been so absent in 2.0. That is why the poachers get away with poaching and that is why the Garleans have been able to set up their base without being blasted into oblivion. The elementals are simply too weak at this point to defend the Shroud like they used to.

define "weakened" as we dun see a weakened but bend to destroy anything in rage elementals if u follow the cnj/whm questline.

[Skies]

define "weakened" as we dun see a weakened but bend to destroy anything in rage elementals if u follow the cnj/whm questline.

Pretty much, we only see elementals once, in one quest in the CNJ questline. That is the single grand occasion they appear, to help out the party nontheless.

[Velox]

Actual serious question for the Legacy Players - has anyone ever seen a male Moon-Keeper in Gridania? I've only seen adult females, which makes it feel like only individuals are settling rather than family groups, otherwise you'd expect to see at least one or two adult males.

Lore-wise, a male Keeper would be the rarest of the rare in the world (amongst all the races currently playable), which is why you don't see any NPC ones (outside of the Coeurl King FATE). This is because the Keeper way of life is very similar to Mithras in FFXI. Males in both clans are rare, but because Keepers tend to keep a matriarchal approach to life, they keep what precious males they do have safely hidden, probably strictly for breeding so that their clan doesn't die out. This is also reflected in their starting stats. Keepers get high MND and PIE stats, showing that they lack physical strength and stamina. Because they don't engage in physical battle (females forbid it), they have plenty of time to engage in mental activities like reading and puzzles (the stuff you'd do when boredom sets in and someone says you can't leave the safety of the clan). Seekers are similar to the Gerudo from the game Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time. Although males are just as rare as Keeper males, they can be leaders within clans (females prefer a patriarchal society), and are more likely to be seen by other adventurers in passing due to being "out in the open" more.

This is why there are no interactive NPC Keeper males and few NPC Seeker males.

[FJerome]

Pretty much, we only see elementals once, in one quest in the CNJ questline. That is the single grand occasion they appear, to help out the party nontheless.

Are the elementals and the Guardian Tree in different factions then? I was under the impression that the Guardian Tree was a type of elemental.

Males in both clans are rare, but because Keepers tend to keep a matriarchal approach to life, they keep what precious males they do have safely hidden, probably strictly for breeding so that their clan doesn't die out.

No, I get that. The reason I asked is because Keepers are starting to settle in Gridania but since we're seeing no males it makes it feel like the settlers are only individual females rather than family groups. Keeper males may be culturally expected to stay safe at home but if there are entire families actually living in Gridania I can't imagine their males are so sheltered that they couldn't go shopping for dinner at the Ebony Stalls or for a pint down at the Carline Canopy.

Admittedly, it's even weirder that we're not seeing female younglings but given there's no younglings at Forgotten Springs either I'm guessing they just don't have a model for them yet. They do have a model for male Keepers so the lack of NPC ones in Gridania seems more intentional.

[Skies]

Are the elementals and the Guardian Tree in different factions then? I was under the impression that the Guardian Tree was a type of elemental.

Nope, they're the same thing (kind of, the elementals are within the tree but are not it), but the big difference being that whoever was the elemental in the Guardian Tree was wounded, and much like a cornered and wounded beast it lashed at whoever was the closest. That was also what your job in that final quest was about, calming it down so it could be healed.