Make FFXIV more like FFXI and less like WoW

[Dale]

my questions was a response to "Make FFXIV more like FFXI and less like WoW" If they were to do that, who's subs would they be competing with?."
?

In theory yes, if they were to make Final Fantasy 14 more like 11 it would likely take even more subscriptions from the game than it already is. But as I said, it's already taking subscriptions from the game now. So the damage to 11 is being done regardless, and we are just debating to what degree.

But like I said in an earlier post, I would have preferred Final Fantasy 14 to be designed as a true sequel to predecessor. A game that would ultimately replace Final Fantasy 11 entirely and give players who want an alternative to WoW somewhere else to go that isn't over a decade old. And to touch on your earlier comments - that would also be the best way to ensure that they are not competing with themselves for subscriptions.

But that didn't happen and instead SE opted to copy WoW. And that is what has players like me disgruntled. Because we were hoping for an alternative to WoW that at least resembled 11 in terms of design and structure.

[Gideon]

But that didn't happen and instead SE opted to copy WoW. And that is what has players like me disgruntled. Because we were hoping for an alternative to WoW that at least resembled 11 in terms of design and structure.

You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

And you havent addressed the fact FFXI 2.0 would actually negatively impact the success of FFXIV (given the peak subscriptions of each).

[Dale]

You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

And you havent addressed the fact FFXI 2.0 would actually negatively impact the success of FFXIV (given the peak subscriptions of each).

I'm not ignoring anything. I just don't agree with you. There is a difference.

I played Final Fantasy 4~10 and all of them resembled each other and were not vastly different from its predecessors. And Final Fantasy 14 isn't vastly different from its predecessor either. It's just that it's predecessor is WoW and not Final Fantasy 11.

[Doo]

You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

Not really they just try to improve on the old systems. Relic - materia - junction system - sphere grid- license board. It's not vastly different more like different takes on older systems.

[Magis]

You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

And you havent addressed the fact FFXI 2.0 would actually negatively impact the success of FFXIV (given the peak subscriptions of each).

Story wise yes, gameplay wise no?

FF I-X had the same battle systems more or less. Turn based, with a few new features added in (materia, limit breaks, swapping characters). They built ONTOP of what they created.

FFXI and (from what I heard) XII had the same system, one being a forced change because turn based battles doesn't work in a real time MMO.

[Reoin05]

"You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

And you havent addressed the fact FFXI 2.0 would actually negatively impact the success of FFXIV (given the peak subscriptions of each). "

Apparently you have not played many of the FF series, most of them are quite alike with little changes, most of them for the better or to give you a new "feel" to the game. FFXI took a turn based system and made it flow, it was still nearly like the others in the menu operation even through battle. I completely agree with some of the above posters, FFXIV has chosen to be a WoW follower and not follow FFXI.

And yes FFXI was difficult, sometimes overly, but that's what was great about it. It gave you something to strive for, and had tons of content to keep you busy even if you could not obtain or do the "harder" content.

3rd- to say that it would actually negatively impact subscriptions? Most people keep all accounts active or move from one to another, so they really don't lose anyone, and on top of that FFXI is not far from death, meaning they will lose those people forever if they don't.

[Vandark]

You're still ignoring the fact that every numerical entry into the FF universe has been vastly different from its predecessors. They've all had some carry over (races,chocobos, themes, etc) but, combat, progression, etc has all been completely different.

And you havent addressed the fact FFXI 2.0 would actually negatively impact the success of FFXIV (given the peak subscriptions of each).

Your wrong most of the older FF series had very slight differences in the combat mostly in ways that impacted the way you advance and layed out/ applyed your skills and abilities that aside the battle systems were always turn based and had very close similarities.

The only FF games that started to become really different are FF12 and FF13 taking on a more automated battle that the majority disliked due to becoming accustomed to their fav style of combat within the series.
Yet even those two titles FF12 and FF13 remained in some way turn based with close resemblances to the previous titles, as a matter of fact FF12 was very alike to FFXI in its open world combat, NM’s and with characters able to progress in all weapon choices while remaining in some form turn based.

The Final Fantasy series until recent have always kept to the series, FF14 the original was still a slower paced strategy system which resembled the gaming style of the previous games.
If it doesn’t play like Final Fantasy I’m sorry but that is no longer a complete Final Fantasy experience.

[Gilthas]

If it doesn’t play like Final Fantasy I’m sorry but that is no longer a complete Final Fantasy experience.

The only reason you're saying that this doesn't play like a FF is because it doesn't use the same system that FFXI had.

The game sure feels like playing a FF to me. Getting to use abilities a lot more often than in FFXI just makes the game more fun to me, not less FF.

[Vandark]

The only reason you're saying that this doesn't play like a FF is because it doesn't use the same system that FFXI had.

The game sure feels like playing a FF to me. Getting to use abilities a lot more often than in FFXI just makes the game more fun to me, not less FF.

lol more abilities than FFXI, perhaps on melle classes but the magic classes in ARR are a flat out joke. Also in the old FF14 you could use way more skills than now, so no I'm not impressed.
I find strategizing alot more appealing than spam so I'm afrade your wrong, there are many reasons why I don't think ARR plays at all like an Final Fantasy game.

If the world didn't look like Final Fantasy it would be the same as all those other wow rip offs there is no difference to me.

Many of us like this experience. Please stop trying to change the game we love into something we don't want.

Don't be a hipocrit, the game has already changed from something I love and I am not asking the game be changed simply that they bring back some old content not as a replacement for current content but as an alternative way of progressing in the game.

FFXI had a large range of options for end game progression it wasn't the same direction for everyone, it would make the world more interesting too because not everyone would be running around with the exact same end game equipment.

[MageBlack]

In theory yes, if they were to make Final Fantasy 14 more like 11 it would likely take even more subscriptions from the game than it already is. But as I said, it's already taking subscriptions from the game now. So the damage to 11 is being done regardless, and we are just debating to what degree.

But like I said in an earlier post, I would have preferred Final Fantasy 14 to be designed as a true sequel to predecessor. A game that would ultimately replace Final Fantasy 11 entirely and give players who want an alternative to WoW somewhere else to go that isn't over a decade old. And to touch on your earlier comments - that would also be the best way to ensure that they are not competing with themselves for subscriptions.

But that didn't happen and instead SE opted to copy WoW. And that is what has players like me disgruntled. Because we were hoping for an alternative to WoW that at least resembled 11 in terms of design and structure.

Fair enough, I think we have worked out what each of us meant. Thats all I wanted. I agree, damage has been done but it was inevitable. I think something you are not really aware of is that each numbered installment of the Final Fantasy franchise plays differently. That is a fundamental feature of the franchise along with each installment being in its own unique world. The only way you would have gotten what you are asking for in a similar experience to FFXI that was built on its strengths and ironed out weaknesses would be if there was a FFXI-2. Its the only time that a FF game has used the same world and built upon its preceding systems.

It does not sound like you are a big FF fan and more of an MMO fan, so i understand why you may have these expectations. In my opinion, as a fan of the FF franchise, this is a great installment in the series and live up to all the expectation I have for such a game, moreso than FFXI did. I played both and I much prefer ARR to FFXI from a FF fan perspective. I dont have much MMO background but I see so many people talking about all their expertise and expectation on the MMO genre but they all see to forget the the second half of the acronym; RPG. I really like that there is a much heavier focus on the RPG elements, story, classic jobs, classic experiences (the nods to older FF games), and the less competitive atmosphere this game has.

There were things I did like about FFXI and I have no problems seeing some things make an appearance in this FF, but overall, i'm glad its not a sequel to FFXI in how it plays. If it was then I doubt it would have gained much more of a following than their first MMO did, and that would have been sad.