Wat you miss when abandoning leves

[darkstarpoet1]

Yeah, I think it was basically just their not realizing what the eventual outcome of their fix would be, which happens.

I think it was basically something like this:

Players: "Hey, it sucks if we trade in a lot of leves to boost a reward, then fail it just because we d/c'd. Also, faction leves. . . yeah"
SE: "Oh, well, we'll just let you retry the next day if you fail, then."
Players: "Did you guys realize this means we can keep linking the same leves day after day after day?"
SE: "That's cool. I mean, you're not getting the rewards for it, but whatever."

Whole thing could've been diverted at step 2 by fixing the problem with failing leves when you d/c, but they chose a different route. And, to be fair, it's not so much a problem with allowing us to retry failed leves as it is a result of our nature as players to try to streamline things, IMO. As I said, I don't really have a problem with doing it, because I know that, no matter what, we're going to try to min/max our SP/hr gains from leves. If that means failing on purpose, well. . .

undoubtedly you didn't read the se response to failing the leves. they actally stated they made it 36 hours because of people disconnecting and abandoning leves so they made it to where they could not repeat them immediately. in other words they knew exactly what they were doing and said it is fine as long as you wait until the next reset to run the same leves again. do your own research and show that they have said they did not know. it has been posted in these forums many times the responses to this and people are not going to research for you again.

[Viridiana]

undoubtedly you didn't read the se response to failing the leves. they actally stated they made it 36 hours because of people disconnecting and abandoning leves so they made it to where they could not repeat them immediately. in other words they knew exactly what they were doing and said it is fine as long as you wait until the next reset to run the same leves again. do your own research and show that they have said they did not know. it has been posted in these forums many times the responses to this and people are not going to research for you again.

Hmm. . . after a quick search, I see the comment you're talking about. For some reason I'd always thought retrying was a response to d/c-fails. At any rate, my last paragraph (minus the first sentence, I suppose) still stands. One paragraph out of four is. . . not bad?

For those who are curious and/or lazy, I'm pretty sure this is the response in question. If I'm still wrong, though, let me know.

[Raikki]

Hmm. . . after a quick search, I see the comment you're talking about. For some reason I'd always thought retrying was a response to d/c-fails. At any rate, my last paragraph (minus the first sentence, I suppose) still stands. One paragraph out of four is. . . not bad?

For those who are curious and/or lazy, I'm pretty sure this is the response in question. If I'm still wrong, though, let me know.

Wow, THIS is what people have been referencing? This is pre-live, while nobody even abused leves like this until several months after this, following massive changes to the SP systems and to leve-link bonuses. We're not even saying that this is against the ToS though. Even AFK leveling isn't actually against the ToS, however much most of us here would like it to be. There's simply zero difference between AFK leveling and abusing leve fails. Both are clearly not how the developers want the game to work and are results of flaws in the game mechanics. When you get people saying one is a-ok while the other is evil and cheating, it's pretty obvious they're hypocrites.

[darkstarpoet1]

Wow, THIS is what people have been referencing? This is pre-live, while nobody even abused leves like this until several months after this, following massive changes to the SP systems and to leve-link bonuses. We're not even saying that this is against the ToS though. Even AFK leveling isn't actually against the ToS, however much most of us here would like it to be. There's simply zero difference between AFK leveling and abusing leve fails. Both are clearly not how the developers want the game to work and are results of flaws in the game mechanics. When you get people saying one is a-ok while the other is evil and cheating, it's pretty obvious they're hypocrites.

no it was not just pre-live. it has been commented on a few times since release when asked directly about abandoning and linking. nice try again though. if you are auto following and a gm stops you and you fail to respond it is considered absentee playing so it can be punishable by ban. i'm not saying that it will be in most cases nor should it be as that is a different discussion than what this topic is about.

[Raikki]

no it was not just pre-live. it has been commented on a few times since release when asked directly about abandoning and linking. nice try again though. if you are auto following and a gm stops you and you fail to respond it is considered absentee playing so it can be punishable by ban. i'm not saying that it will be in most cases nor should it be as that is a different discussion than what this topic is about.

[citation needed]

Auto-follow leveling/power leveling has never been against the rules. Astral burn parties weren't prohibited in FFXI despite the people benefiting doing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING (and being perfectly free to AFK). SE explicitly said astral burn was allowed.

[darkstarpoet1]

[citation needed]

Auto-follow leveling/power leveling has never been against the rules. Astral burn parties weren't prohibited in FFXI despite the people benefiting doing ABSOLUTELY NOTHING (and being perfectly free to AFK). SE explicitly said astral burn was allowed.

se also stated that linking and abandoning was allowed, but you want to say it's ok for one thing, but not for another. pick your battle. if se says it is ok then both are, but you want to contend one is and the other is not.

why don't you look up the tos in which they discuss absentee leveling. they state directly that if a gm contacts you and you fail to respond it may be considered absentee leveling. like i said i did not say that it should be, but you have to admit anytime you leave a decision up to the discretion of a single individual today you may get banned for the same thing you have done multiple times before. i did not say it should have people get punished for this, but on a bad day a gm can punish when not needed.

[Vackashken]

se also stated that linking and abandoning was allowed, but you want to say it's ok for one thing, but not for another. pick your battle. if se says it is ok then both are, but you want to contend one is and the other is not.

why don't you look up the tos in which they discuss absentee leveling. they state directly that if a gm contacts you and you fail to respond it may be considered absentee leveling. like i said i did not say that it should be, but you have to admit anytime you leave a decision up to the discretion of a single individual today you may get banned for the same thing you have done multiple times before. i did not say it should have people get punished for this, but on a bad day a gm can punish when not needed.

Its kind of amusing watching you dance around the issue. No one said its against tos, nor that its my business on a personal one-on-one level or that SE said this or didn't say that. Again, the bottom line is rewarding for failure is ass backwards. Try and dissect it anyway you want with one of you vitriolic post but nothing changes the very idea is failure. Hard work should equal reward. Not the other way around. Period.

[Raikki]

se also stated that linking and abandoning was allowed, but you want to say it's ok for one thing, but not for another. pick your battle. if se says it is ok then both are, but you want to contend one is and the other is not.

Check your reading comprehension? I never said one is ok and the other is not, that's actually what you've been saying. Both are allowed under the ToS. Both should be patched out of the game. I lose respect for people who heavily abuse either method.

why don't you look up the tos in which they discuss absentee leveling. they state directly that if a gm contacts you and you fail to respond it may be considered absentee leveling. like i said i did not say that it should be, but you have to admit anytime you leave a decision up to the discretion of a single individual today you may get banned for the same thing you have done multiple times before. i did not say it should have people get punished for this, but on a bad day a gm can punish when not needed.

The ToS was already quoted in this thread and said nothing of the sort. Try again.

Edit: let's nip this one in the bud --

Activities that destroy game balance
Using third party programs or tools in FINAL FANTASY XIV is strictly prohibited since they allow users to gain an unfair advantage over other players. The use of programs or tools within FINAL FANTASY XIV that allow certain continuous actions to be performed automatically are often referred to as absentee play, which is also prohibited in FINAL FANTASY XIV. Additionally, during the course of an absentee play investigation, players may be requested to respond to or comply with a GMs instruction. Failure to do so is consider a violation and may result in disciplinary action being taken against the account.

If you turn your reading comprehension on for a moment you'll realize this section of the ToS is talking about using third party programs or tools.

Prohibited absentee play is performing actions while not at the keyboard.