so i was wondering about Whm and WP

[Bellybell]

thank you, Aphrini!
didn't expected anyone greeting newcomer in the forum.

[Aphrini]

Well I noticed, and I am excited to hear your opinions and help learn from what you have to input

[LiadansWhisper]

I just find it absurd, our only job, only actual thing we MUST do is cure the person that is dying, and we are very good at it. If it was 2 or 3 Ton, or even maybe a couple of the Skele with undergeared beginning end game gear I could see that too. However one Tonberry which btw can be slept is not ok to die from. I think the WHM was feeling overwhelmed, fell into panic, froze up on what to do and dropped. It happens to the best of us, but pinning it on others even if legit given the vast tools in our tool chest for those issues is not an excuse.

Actually, re-reading it, it sounds like this was Tonberry King?

In my experience, even 1 Tonberry abruptly aggro'ing a healer can lead to death, especially if the tank is about to/has just taken the special attack from Tonberry King (meaning the healer has to drop heavy heals on him quickly if he's ALSO tanking a pack of tonberry adds). If you get more than one Tonberry on you in that fight, the healer is normally dead before he/she can react, because they hit you with that ridiculous slow. I've literally dropped in between the time it takes to Swiftcast + Raise someone, so I can see how the healer may have been unable to react fast enough to save their life.

It still isn't a healer's responsibility to DPS the add AND save the tank from the special attack at the same time. Even we can only do one thing at a time (and no, Medica isn't enough to heal thru the little tonberry slow crap). Can you even sleep the adds on Tonberry King? I've never tried, tbh... Don't think that would help much, tho, given how fast they eat you if there's more than one on you.

@Bella: Also, hello and welcome!

[Dyssyd]

You shouldn't speed run with stupid people. I'm always the one killing the little berry's on the King.

Stone II + aero for the first 2. Pop off a holy or two on the big packs. King should be dead before anything bad could happen.

[Brises]

I have never been attacked by the Tonberry King adds, so I have to wonder what the healer was doing? And I do DPS the boss while healing, esuna and stone. But normally, someone is assigned to take out the adds. In my groups, usually a bard. WHM can holy them also, but in my groups we don't do it that way, and we make short work of that fight and nobody ever dies.

[LiadansWhisper]

I have never been attacked by the Tonberry King adds, so I have to wonder what the healer was doing? And I do DPS the boss while healing, esuna and stone. But normally, someone is assigned to take out the adds. In my groups, usually a bard. WHM can holy them also, but in my groups we don't do it that way, and we make short work of that fight and nobody ever dies.

Most likely, the tank wasn't AoE tanking and they were ignoring the adds. It's a fairly common strategy in WP, but if the tank isn't actually using Circle of Scorn and Flash in his rotation, the healer healing him (from all the Tonberries showing up and beating on him) will quickly pull threat.

[Brises]

Most likely, the tank wasn't AoE tanking and they were ignoring the adds. It's a fairly common strategy in WP, but if the tank isn't actually using Circle of Scorn and Flash in his rotation, the healer healing him (from all the Tonberries showing up and beating on him) will quickly pull threat.

Actually, in my groups the adds never reach the tank. We have a bard who loves to pick them off, lol. That's why I throw my DPS at the boss.

[Freakiie]

I have never been attacked by the Tonberry King adds, so I have to wonder what the healer was doing? And I do DPS the boss while healing, esuna and stone. But normally, someone is assigned to take out the adds. In my groups, usually a bard. WHM can holy them also, but in my groups we don't do it that way, and we make short work of that fight and nobody ever dies.

You'd need them to be tagged by a very weak attack and then toss a strong enough heal onto the person. I've seen it happen, very rarely, when they got tagged with a weak DoT and I healed that person right after because he got hit by that attack. Still, pretty rare case.

Anyway. As I haven't been hit that much by that attack (or seen people get hit by it), can it actually do that much damage? Only times I've really seen those small adds kill anyone was when they got overwhelmed by adds. From the way the Whm reacted it sounds to me he simply was a jerk by not healing himself on purpose to show the DDs or something. Going into cleric stance, hitting it with aero and fluid aura and switching back really shouldn't be an issue. Heck if you're really speedrunning it you're generally in Cleric Stance for most of the boss anyway since regen covers most off the damage, until the boss uses Grudge.

So yeah, in this case all I can say is that the Whm was being a jerk considering he can easily twoshot those adds and they really shouldn't be doing so much damage you'd actually die to them.

Most likely, the tank wasn't AoE tanking and they were ignoring the adds. It's a fairly common strategy in WP, but if the tank isn't actually using Circle of Scorn and Flash in his rotation, the healer healing him (from all the Tonberries showing up and beating on him) will quickly pull threat.

I assume the kiting method? From what I've seen when the tank used that the mobs don't tag anyone until they're actually damaged. Then again, I've rarely seen that tactic used, so perhaps I just remember it wrong since it's been a while.

[YuiSasaki]

I tank all of those small tonberries as a SCH (tested with a WHM buddy works too). Oo

Edit: They hit for ~200 when you've never aggroed the king.

[LiadansWhisper]

Actually, in my groups the adds never reach the tank. We have a bard who loves to pick them off, lol.

Okay, well, that's cool, too. But that kind of has nothing to do with what I was saying. :-\ I was explaining the most common reason for a WHM to get threat on a Tonberry add, in my experience. I'm glad that you've found your own way of dealing with them.

I assume the kiting method? From what I've seen when the tank used that the mobs don't tag anyone until they're actually damaged. Then again, I've rarely seen that tactic used, so perhaps I just remember it wrong since it's been a while.

No, they literally just stand there and face tank the boss and all of the adds. If you have a good pally, the AoE from his tanking rotation + whatever AoE the DPS put down (if they have any) is enough to keep them of you, and slowly kill them over time. If the boss gets too many stacks, you just pop Hallowed Ground for the Grudge.