Light/full Party buff

[Rentahamster]

FYI I wasn't trying to refute your points. I was making points myself. OK? thanks. Now think about it for a little and it might make sense.

Yes, I know what you were trying to do, and because your own points do not show how the light/full party buff is actually worthwhile, and because they do not address my points about how the light/full party buffs are meaningless, that shows how your points are irrelevant.

Everything you said here:

Once again, this isn't made for the content you have today. An AFK player in a full party dungeon will most likely do you more harm than good. An AFK player when the mobs are rebalanced will most likely cause your party to wipe. They are clearly building the game in two phases now, one for solo play or smaller duo/trio parties and one for light and full party play, in order to separate the balance of the two and make party play more challenging and rewarding they give you party boosts...not a big deal. There is nothing more to argue here, I've said my piece and I have nothing more to say, this subject already bored me, but think about it.

does not provide any kind of justification as to how an arbitrary stat buff is supposed to "make party play more challenging and rewarding".

Gameplay is exactly the same with or without it. The only difference is that with a light/full party buff, you are being rewarded just on the "merit" of having 4 or 8 people, nothing more.

[Mack]

Yes, I know what you were trying to do, and because your own points do not show how the light/full party buff is actually worthwhile, and because they do not address my points about how the light/full party buffs are meaningless, that shows how your points are irrelevant.

Everything you said here:



does not provide any kind of justification as to how an arbitrary stat buff is supposed to "make party play more challenging and rewarding".

Gameplay is exactly the same with or without it. The only difference is that with a light/full party buff, you are being rewarded just on the "merit" of having 4 or 8 people, nothing more.

Except that it does, because I and SE have said that these party buffs are to properly separate the balance between dungeons and overworld play...why don't you just wait and see how it plays out? once again its not to prep you for behests and leves or the overworld NMs because clearly the balance is botched and obviosly they will be working on that...honestly now, with all due respect to your opinions, I'm really really bored by this topic now and you're arguing with me for the hell of it now with no good reason. Believe what you want, all I was saying is wait for the battle changes which are coming soon anyway...or you know, you guys can cry like little babies some more.

[Rentahamster]

Except that it does, because I and SE have said that these party buffs are to properly separate the balance between dungeons and overworld play

Buffs work regardless of whether you're in a dungeon or in the overworld. Think about it - how is a buff supposed to "balance" anything? Unless the dungeon content is too hard for just a 4-man party without the buff. But if that's the case, the proper course to balance the content would be to make it 5% easier. Adding extraneous functions like a 5% buff just for the sake of having a 4-player party is unnecessary and arbitrary. There is no reason to add more and more constructs onto the game, when the same result could just have easily be accomplished though other means already in the system.

with all due respect to your opinions, I'm really really bored by this topic now and you're arguing with me for the hell of it now with no good reason.

I responded to you because you responded to me. That's how a forum discussion works. I do have a good reason for the point that I made because I'm pointing out design flaws in the reasoning for the party buff and showing how it is meaningless, regardless of the type of content.

or you know, you guys can cry like little babies some more.

Having a debate about game mechanics is hardly "crying like little babies". Try not to impugn the motives of other forum users.

[Mack]

Unless the dungeon content is too hard for just a 4-man party without the buff.

Bingo!!!!!!!!!!!

[Rentahamster]

Bingo!!!!!!!!!!!

That's the point I'm trying to make.

If the dungeon content is too hard for just a 4-man party without the buff, why design it that way?

Design the dungeon content to be just right for a 4-man party without the buff from the start.

Is there any particular reason why a 5% across the board boost somehow makes dungeon content balancing easier? No, there isn't. It's a 5% global boost. It's not specific to anything.

Why bother adding an extra layer of unnecessary complexity that is the 5% party buff? Why not instead just adjust the dungeon content to be 5% weaker to be balanced with a normal, 4-man party?

All things being equal, it is better to balance content by working within the means of existing systems instead of trying to add more bells and whistles, especially if those bells and whistles also bring with them unintended consequences that negatively effect gameplay.

[Frebaut]

That's the point I'm trying to make.

If the dungeon content is too hard for just a 4-man party without the buff, why design it that way?

Design the dungeon content to be just right for a 4-man party without the buff from the start.

Is there any particular reason why a 5% across the board boost somehow makes dungeon content balancing easier? No, there isn't. It's a 5% global boost. It's not specific to anything.

Why bother adding an extra layer of unnecessary complexity that is the 5% party buff? Why not instead just adjust the dungeon content to be 5% weaker to be balanced with a normal, 4-man party?

All things being equal, it is better to balance content by working within the means of existing systems instead of trying to add more bells and whistles, especially if those bells and whistles also bring with them unintended consequences that negatively effect gameplay.

Why are you assuming their making the Dungeons to accommodate the buffs? With the way the game is now either you Zerg through mobs or Their AoE wipes everyone in rang ( IMPS ). You guys over analyze everything. Its funny on the German thread the little they do have they fricken laugh at this American one about how people talk it to death. I agree with them. Wait till the dam content comes out then Bitch and complain if its to easy. No matter what people say SE will release it how they see fit them tweak it if it needs to be.
EDIT: The buff was to add incentive to party play, thats why the buff is so low at 4 and 8 man parties.

[Rentahamster]

Why are you assuming their making the Dungeons to accommodate the buffs?

I'm not. That was the argument that the other posters were making.

EDIT: The buff was to add incentive to party play, thats why the buff is so low at 4 and 8 man parties.

I know why they added the party buffs. I'm just saying that from a design and gameplay perspective, it doesn't address any kind of problem, and it encourages poor behavior.

[Mack]

Is there any particular reason why a 5% across the board boost somehow makes dungeon content balancing easier? No, there isn't. It's a 5% global boost. It's not specific to anything.

hmmm I see your point now, yea I have no idea in this regard tbh.