How to release raid content for both casual and hard core players every patch.

[Mcshiggs]

And by the way, leveling classes is NOT content.

Quests are content, leveling each job and class comes with it's own set of quests, making leveling classes content. It may not be the content you want but it is still content people are choosing not to do, then complaining there isn't enough to keep them busy. Some people like raiding, some people like the story, some like everything, SE is putting stuff out for everybody, not just one group, if you choose not to participate in part of it, that is on you not them. You may have been one of those that fate grinded every job to 50 in a couple days, and skipped the story on the quests and just ran to where the map told you to go, for people like that leveling isn't content, and for people like that I don't care about your opinion when you complain about lack of content.

[permbanned]

Quests are content, leveling each job and class comes with it's own set of quests, making leveling classes content. It may not be the content you want but it is still content people are choosing not to do, then complaining there isn't enough to keep them busy. Some people like raiding, some people like the story, some like everything, SE is putting stuff out for everybody, not just one group, if you choose not to participate in part of it, that is on you not them. You may have been one of those that fate grinded every job to 50 in a couple days, and skipped the story on the quests and just ran to where the map told you to go, for people like that leveling isn't content, and for people like that I don't care about your opinion when you complain about lack of content.

No, I came here with all 50s already and read all the main story and every single class and job quest, which really only took a few weeks to go through it all. Some were good, some were just terrible. I didn't just fate grind everything like you assume I did, but whatever.

And seriously, this happens all the f'n time. When someone doesn't have all their classes leveled people like you tell them "hey why don't you level your classes!" but when they do you come back with "derp, you rushed through the game and fate grinded everything." Like, really? Are you serious?

And what I find extremely funny is this

And yet the casual argument is always "because it's what I want you to want."

I see this over and over and over again. Hardcores want stuff to do and don't care what casuals get, because they know they'll always get something. But casuals don't want hardcores to have anything, period. They want hardcore players to play the game exactly the same way they do, and even tell them that "this is what you should enjoy doing."

Don't believe me? Read all the "you should be leveling alt classes" or "you played too fast" or "maybe you should go outside or get a job" posts, because it's always the same shit. I'm so sick of this already.

Posted in this exact thread...

Thank you for proving my point.

Are you going to tell me to go outside and get a job next? Because I own my own business. Or tell me to quit? That's a common one too.

[Acaelus]

This is why we don't have nice things.

[Raikki]

content people are choosing not to do, then complaining there isn't enough to keep them busy

if you choose not to participate in part of it, that is on you not them.

there is plenty of content you are refusing to participate in

No, when people aren't participating in content, it means the developers goofed, not the players. All games work on a reward structure. When that reward structure fails, the game fails, and sadly the reward structure in this game has been failing so far. Gear is one of the most common reward systems used in RPGs, but of course gear isn't the only reward. A sense of accomplishment can be considered a reward, too. That's where things get tricky and where you're having trouble seeing things from another perspective. Different people feel accomplishment from different things, and no matter how many times you argue with them about it, it's not going to change the fact that when they do many of the exact same things you really enjoy doing in the game, they do not get the same sense of accomplishment you do.

It is insulting to tell someone that they're wrong for what does or does not instill them with a sense of accomplishment. It is also insulting to tell someone to quit the game if they don't enjoy the same things you do. People are merely voicing their frustrations and their suggestions because they see potential in the game that they feel is being squandered.

[Mcshiggs]

It is insulting to tell someone that they're wrong for what does or does not instill them with a sense of accomplishment. It is also insulting to tell someone to quit the game if they don't enjoy the same things you do. People are merely voicing their frustrations and their suggestions because they see potential in the game that they feel is being squandered.

When you start playing a game where a core mechanic of that game is being able to level every class on a single character, and ignore that aspect of the game and just concentrate on a single class, you should expect to run out of content before the next patch. The game was made around that. Refusing to participate in that content, and then coming to the forums and crying that the devs didn't give you enough to do is just childish, when you leave so much undone. Sure different people get a sense of accomplishment from different things, but to think that they should only release content for the "hardcore" group is just selfish. They gave you turns 1-5 of coil 3 months early, that was SE trying to do something for the hardcore. They did that and then had to choose if they were going to release a large amount of content that caters to many different types of players, or they would have had to dump a lot of those resources so they could do another section of coil, probably rush it out, and be filled with bugs, so they could make the hardcore people happy. You need to realize the backwards progression in gear and all that people are complaining about came from SE trying to make those exact people happy by giving them Coil early. I'm not a game maker, but I'm pretty sure it would be difficult to put another endgame dungeon together in just 3 months, that's how I can be fine with it the way it is, we had coil, now we have the proper progression for it, and next patch we can go from there. I'll be happy doing a little of everything, I finished my fishing log yesterday, have two luminaries down, still plenty to do, even without the patch. As for people quitting, it's not quit if they don't like the same things I do, it's maybe they should think about it if they only like playing one to two hours a week, why pay for that, and then complain about it? If you keep paying then clearly the model they are using is working extremely well, put out less than what all these people want, but get the money all the same. As consumers, our money is our vote.

[permbanned]

When you start playing a game where a core mechanic of that game is being able to level every class on a single character, and ignore that aspect of the game and just concentrate on a single class, you should expect to run out of content before the next patch. The game was made around that. Refusing to participate in that content, and then coming to the forums and crying that the devs didn't give you enough to do is just childish, when you leave so much undone. Sure different people get a sense of accomplishment from different things, but to think that they should only release content for the "hardcore" group is just selfish. They gave you turns 1-5 of coil 3 months early, that was SE trying to do something for the hardcore. They did that and then had to choose if they were going to release a large amount of content that caters to many different types of players, or they would have had to dump a lot of those resources so they could do another section of coil, probably rush it out, and be filled with bugs, so they could make the hardcore people happy. You need to realize the backwards progression in gear and all that people are complaining about came from SE trying to make those exact people happy by giving them Coil early. I'm not a game maker, but I'm pretty sure it would be difficult to put another endgame dungeon together in just 3 months, that's how I can be fine with it the way it is, we had coil, now we have the proper progression for it, and next patch we can go from there. I'll be happy doing a little of everything, I finished my fishing log yesterday, have two luminaries down, still plenty to do, even without the patch.

Coil was always meant to be released with 2.0, stop making stuff up.

[Mcshiggs]

Coil was always meant to be released with 2.0, stop making stuff up.

Coil was planned to be released either alongside, or shortly following Crystal Tower. From a progressive standpoint, since Crystal Tower was delayed, Coil should have been delayed, but they put it out early, you know, before Crystal tower.

[permbanned]

Coil was planned to be released either alongside, or shortly following Crystal Tower. From a progressive standpoint, since Crystal Tower was delayed, Coil should have been delayed, but they put it out early, you know, before Crystal tower.

No. Coil was always meant to be released with 2.0. CT got pushed back. That was the only difference.

If you're going to argue with someone, at least know what you're talking about.

[Acaelus]

No. Coil was always meant to be released with 2.0. CT got pushed back. That was the only difference.

If you're going to argue with someone, at least know what you're talking about.

If you don't start playing nice, I'll turn this car around and we can go home.

[Xikkorak]

Sure different people get a sense of accomplishment from different things, but to think that they should only release content for the "hardcore" group is just selfish.

I don't think anyone is asking them to release ONLY hardcore content. It's ridiculous to expect people not to ask for the type of content they want to play though. I personally enjoy a good challenge and like being pushed to my limits. Doing coil a couple hours a week tops and then 4 easy dungeons designed for fresh 50's in AF1 gear is not my idea of an engaging experience.

Hopefully 2.1 will have some interesting stuff for everyone but you have to see how redundant most of this content sounds to people who are in/farming coil already.