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  1. #531
    Player
    Rentahamster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Lindblum MRD50/THM50/LNC50
    Posts
    2,823
    Character
    Renta Hamster
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by TheVedis View Post
    the obvious answer for any player who wants to be able to avoid certain attacks, or do what he wants, is "get rid of it, its not helping us"

    but thats also the entire point, not every aspect should be helpful
    we should have some hinderences,
    Yes, I know. There are costs that are specifically put in place to facilitate good gameplay. That is why we have stuff like HP, MP, TP, casting times, etc.

    That is why we can't chain all our moves together in Street Fighter and have to use timing and precision to initiate combos.

    That is why I can't just automatically upgrade to Tier III tech in Starcraft so I have to balance resource management, time, and cost/benefit.

    But again, what does animation-lock do to promote good gameplay?
    I can give reasons how it doesn't promote good gamplay.

    It doesn't promote good positioning. It actually inhibits a player trying to use positioning when wanting to avoid TP moves.

    It doesn't inhibit spamming moves, since I can still be locked into position at the same time as a mob's TP move even if I'm not spamming.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheVedis View Post
    not everything should be instant/seemless, its not just an on off switch you think about and its there, you have to do something to use it, which is the animation/pause
    and we are talking a fraction of a second to do this
    It's longer than a fraction of a second. It's long enough that gets in the way of active evading.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheVedis View Post
    now granted, maybe a better solution, is to actualy have mobs who are using deathblow type moves give some sort of more advanced warning they are about to do it, so that people arent using an ability right as the mob uses theirs with no warning and cant get out of it....
    They already do give advanced warning: That red/purple aura glow as well as "Dodore readies Tail Whip" in the chat log.
    (0)

  2. #532
    Player
    Physic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,616
    Character
    Bladed Arms
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Rentahamster View Post
    But why? Just ask yourself:

    "Does forcing my character to be subject to animation-lock contribute to battle depth and the formation of strategy, or place a needed restriction that encourages smart gameplay?"

    If yes, then keep it.

    If no, then ditch it.

    When I ask myself that question, the answer is "no".
    yes
    save your attacks and skills for when the enemy has just attacked, or done a tp skill.
    strategy is hold back and attack when there is an opening. This is a strategic concept.

    monsters can not attack at will, they have a cooldown after each physical attack, and tp manuevers are based on them having tp available, they also warn you. Consider that some skills were made for people in other roles to be able to run from, whereas you as a gladiator tank readying sheild wont be able to dodge, because you have to always guard as soon as its available, thats the price for the defense you have with readying sheild

    this is tactics, and roles, and the advantages/disadvantages of being the tank
    (0)
    Last edited by Physic; 05-30-2011 at 04:40 AM.

  3. #533
    Player
    Rentahamster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Lindblum MRD50/THM50/LNC50
    Posts
    2,823
    Character
    Renta Hamster
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Physic View Post
    yes save your attacks and skills for when the enemy has just attacked, or done a tp skill.
    strategy is hold back and attack when there is an opening. This is a strategic concept.
    That doesn't work in the actual game since enemy TP move activation is random and highly variant depending on the party makeup.
    (0)

  4. #534
    Player
    Physic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,616
    Character
    Bladed Arms
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Rentahamster View Post
    That doesn't work in the actual game since enemy TP move activation is random and highly variant depending on the party makeup.
    skills that dont allow for you to dodge with your fastest skills level of animation lock (some are shorter than others, like light strike on pug is really fast, as is stab on gladiator) are probably not meant for YOU to be able to dodge, but lancer on the other hand probably can. Some tp attacks are meant to be tanked, and some are meant to be dodged, this goes to knowing your enemy, and knowing the limitations of your charachter. Its also tactics in how much you do and how often you are animation locked.

    And i have dodged a great many tp attacks, and gotten hit by them when i decided to go all out DD, or am in the middle of a skill, it was choice. do i move, or do i hold fast, do i attack or do i wait. This is how attacks having animation locks causes skill in play, when you choose every action. Just like in SF if i use a super, i will be locked in place longer than if i dont attack, or use a jab. Its not a foreign concept to games.

    It is actually tactical and makes sense, but some people just dont want that type of gameplay, you may be among them, but it made sense.
    (0)
    Last edited by Physic; 05-30-2011 at 04:53 AM.

  5. #535
    Player
    Reika's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    4,429
    Character
    Reika Shadowheart
    World
    Durandal
    Main Class
    Armorer Lv 80
    If they want end-game mosnters, Boss type and such, to focus more on tactics and moving around, they will have to get rid of the stop-to-act that goes on now.
    (2)

  6. #536
    Player
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    4,964
    You should not be able to move while attacking, although you should be able to cancle your action or attack and then move. Viola I just solved animation locking with a simple cancelation mechanic. Running in circles and attacking is borderline rediculous.

    At most there should be some sort of high accuracy and/or damage penalty for moving around while you attack.
    (1)

  7. #537
    Player
    b0ats's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    PWL
    Posts
    244
    Character
    Entaro Tassadar
    World
    Sargatanas
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Rentahamster View Post
    I can imagine this all too well.

    http://i.imgur.com/WBWtH.jpg
    hahaha so good!
    (0)

  8. #538
    Player

    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    37
    Ability aesthetics will be improved, great I feel happy about that except I have my doubts at the same time...

    I have a feeling there will be a fair amount of "this is already unique" going on, instead of striving to make animations more powerful/flashier?

    What's my main set of examples? I'm pretty sure you've guessed... Ancient Magic and even Elemental Magic.

    I've said this time and time again, add some flare into these key elements (no pun intended) and staples of the FF name... jeez the last thing I want to see going from Fire I -> Fire II is a particle size increase, maybe a little extra glow. Hell even FFXI made nicer effects going upwards through spell tiers, and the -ga spells as well.

    I will make a new paragraph for Ancient magic alone, because they are HORRIBLE. My god, I don't know how someone could even allow these pity little animations into the game branded with an FF label. Seriously these sorts of staples can't disappoint, and they are seriously lacking at the moment.

    With that all being said I hope that spell animations are being looked at with the aim more towards a "animation revamp" instead of a "unique casting animation" addition.

    That is all... I hope SE never hears the end of this until it is something that is looked at, because right now I don't feel way more excited casting Fire II instead of Fire I for example, (especially because of the not worthwhile casting/cd/damage changes between the tiers... however I know that's being addressed so I am thankful for that)

    - Hellsoul out
    (2)

  9. #539
    Player
    Onidemon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    1,414
    Character
    Aaran Oni
    World
    Faerie
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Rentahamster View Post
    This is a pretty lame complaint and I don't think it has much merit. The reason why that person has higher level spells is because he's a higher rank CON than you, duh. Why shouldn't he be able to do so if he's already put in the effort to learn them? Besides, the skills are scaled back due to being used off-class anyway.

    I dont think it was lame at all. Theres no reason a warrior type class should be able to heal better then a conjurer.... even if he is higher. The whole mix and match abilities system is broken and this is what creates these problems. Sure im all for being able to use abilities from different classes but you have to limit it. A Gladiator should be stuck at using cure I and II no more or even not being able to use cure at all but can use different melee type of spells.
    (0)

  10. #540
    Player
    Teknoman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    1,142
    Character
    Teknoman Blade
    World
    Ultros
    Main Class
    Gladiator Lv 60
    Well the job system and skill balancing/adjustments should fix most of that.
    (0)


    "There are many difficult times ahead, but you must keep your sense of humor, work through the tough situations and enjoy yourself".

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