Issues with Coil: Statics v. The Rest of Us

[SarcasmMisser]

It was said that very few people would clear coil this year, it is absolutely intended to be exclusive and not for the have nots.

As it stands right now many people are just logging in for their raid times and that's it, there is nothing else to do until a content update. Take away that and you leave a lot of very dedicated players with nothing to work for.

There is exactly one (1) piece of content in the game that is designed for statics, it is not much to ask for that there is at least something left for people who enjoy to play like this. Personally, progressing in a static feels very rewarding and I would be sad to see it any other way.

[Moktor]

Personally, progressing in a static feels very rewarding and I would be sad to see it any other way.

Does it change your rewarding feeling if someone else does it another way? I don't care either way, and I do, in fact, understand the need for high end lock outs and such. I just think this rule applies to both sides of the casual/hard core debate. This game is already not hard, and probably derives all of its difficulty from the lag (be it server, video, or w/e else people have trouble with. Worrying about how other people get their gear is the least of this game's problems.

[Slate]

This kind of thinking has been around ever since Ultima Online/Everquest. I can remember being jealous I didn't have that Executioner's Axe when I saw someone carrying it around in the East Commons tunnel entrance (think I got that right lol).

MMOs are all about the haves and have nots. You should have to work for something to get it. Get into an FC. Prove yourself worthy to go on runs with that crew. Or create your own and work your way through it.

I dont think DF will ever work because the strats are more strenuous than Titan HM at times.

Everyone SHOULD have the opportunity to get all gear. However it shouldn't be handed to you. Get out there and do what you have to do in an MMO, be SOCIAL!

[whilke]

This kind of thinking has been around ever since Ultima Online/Everquest. I can remember being jealous I didn't have that Executioner's Axe when I saw someone carrying it around in the East Commons tunnel entrance (think I got that right lol).

Meet you at torch 2

[Argent_Wings]

Everyone says BC is for "experienced" people yet no one raises the question of how people are supposed to experience anything they can't participate in. Unlike reality, there are no colleges or internships for "end game" that allow people to get their feet wet and work their way up to the level of competency that so many of you would demand of your members.

Add BC to the DF, let the people who want to pug it, pug it. Unlike that asinine debate about selling Titan runs, this really DOESN'T affect the people who are already farming it in their exclusive, champagne room-esque groups.

What you're really concerned about is that the milk and honey of bragging rights that comes with being on Turn 4 or 5 wouldn't be quite as sweet if a pug managed to accomplish the same thing. But since we obviously don't believe such levels of group cohesion are possible, why oppose it?

[GilbertLapine]

This kind of thinking has been around ever since Ultima Online/Everquest. I can remember being jealous I didn't have that Executioner's Axe when I saw someone carrying it around in the East Commons tunnel entrance (think I got that right lol).

MMOs are all about the haves and have nots. You should have to work for something to get it. Get into an FC. Prove yourself worthy to go on runs with that crew. Or create your own and work your way through it.

I dont think DF will ever work because the strats are more strenuous than Titan HM at times.

Everyone SHOULD have the opportunity to get all gear. However it shouldn't be handed to you. Get out there and do what you have to do in an MMO, be SOCIAL!

You miss the point. As I've said before, having to "work" for the gear is fine, but it's a game, not the DMV. Before duty-finder-like functionalities were put in games, the hours of LFP shout were understandable and unavoidable -- the infrastructure to fix it simply didn't exist. But there's no excuse for it now.

Also, the lockout system itself, in its current iteration, is antisocial -- as it stands you see your static and run w/ them, and no one else. That's not exactly "massively" multiplayer.

While I agree with the sentiment of the OP, this, along with the Titan HM run selling debate, feel like issues with foundations that might change once gear check is implemented, and I coulda sworn it was mentioned somewhere that they're going to make it easier for the whole LFG-flag system to form pugs from within your own server (so no shouting would be required).

The addition of gear check would mitigate the issue of fresh level 50's in ilvl 45-50 gear trying to waltz into BC before they have the gear necessary to even gauge their 'skill' on the content, where as the ability to form in-server pugs without having to try to dive into the shout spam in Mor D'hona might make it easier for a larger demographic of players to get in on that without necessarily needing DF access. I'm not saying I expect either of these to completely solve the issue, but I'd wager they'd definitely make a big change, so I'm developing a 'wait and see' mentality towards both these issues atm.

(I know gearcheck doesn't mean they're adding BC to the DF, but if it helps the current DF content's success rate, it would make advocating for BC on the DF ballot a touch more reasonable)

I agree with a lot of this, and while gear check would prevent the 'fresh 50' problem, I don't think it'd be an issue anyway since (I think?) you need to clear Titan before you even get the quest for BC.

[Seidaku]

This kind of thinking has been around ever since Ultima Online/Everquest. I can remember being jealous I didn't have that Executioner's Axe when I saw someone carrying it around in the East Commons tunnel entrance (think I got that right lol).

MMOs are all about the haves and have nots. You should have to work for something to get it. Get into an FC. Prove yourself worthy to go on runs with that crew. Or create your own and work your way through it.

I dont think DF will ever work because the strats are more strenuous than Titan HM at times.

Everyone SHOULD have the opportunity to get all gear. However it shouldn't be handed to you. Get out there and do what you have to do in an MMO, be SOCIAL!

LOL, need to get the overpowered item "manastone" pre nerf mask before they nerf/remove it. Oh, they already did one with the Gobue mount. :P

[Cobayn]

I agree with you Gilbert.

ONe thing that's always bothered me in MMOs I've played is that eventually, players start asking for specific people to join their static or pugs. Why shouldn't they? They have a right to and it's common sense to do so if you want to succeed and be effective, but... then it becomes like the old 'can't get a job cause you don't have work experience' thing. If you don't have experience with a particular dungeon, you can't get in the group, but you can't get experience without getting into a group... kinda screwed there.

Making every dungeon available in Duty Find would provide a great option to learn the dungeon, fail or succeed, and get that experience you need to join a that pug or that well established static. Always thought that was the point of Duty Find, since you're grouped up with random people that may or may not have the skills to succeed in a particular dungeon. You can expect to win if you want to but, you're still playing russian roulette.

No one is talking about making the content easier (tho I think I've read that the devs plan to do so as new, harder content is made available, no?), we're just talking about making it more accessible so that people can experience and learn the content. Sure, that'll piss off the elitist among us who like to feel exclusive, but, heh, you never rise above others by kicking them down or keeping them from climbing up.


EDIT: Post above me refers to people selling coil to players who can't complete it. I think the fact that more people would get access to the dungeon and be able to learn it well enough to start joining pugs or statics would mean less people resorting to buying their way through.

[Gooner_iBluAirJGR]

I like both ideas. It would be nice if you could run coils more than once per week but could receive something cool like 10k gil per floor cleared instead of being able to speed farm armor. Would be fun.

[Zikh]

WoW really ruined mmos forever. The whole DF system is an abomination. There is no social interaction anymore, you queue in DF and finish the runs without saying a word. Unless someone fails. Then you start raging or stay silent and quit.

No "time" for linkshells nor FCs, only DF grind and if it's too hard for DF it's obviously "broken". Talking to other people is a bother and finding friends online has become a "chore". This new generation of mmo players is horrible.