The Issue:
Coil has become extremely inaccessible to players with smaller/newer FCs. Those players already farming coil on a weekly basis have are mostly members of static parties, and since they can clear the instance once per week, once a player is claimed in a static they leave the population of potential party members for anyone else. This has lead the pool of potential party members for those affiliate with still budding FCs to be laughably low, and has created a relatively static population of "haves" and "have-nots" when it comes to allagan drops.
The implication of the current system is that many players are now in the difficult position of having to either abandoning their beloved friends and communities in the name of accessing end-game content, or having to wait weeks and even months for their friends to catch up (esp. due to myth cap). This doesn't seem like a wise, or fair, design choice for a game intended to be a) social, and b) a game. I still don't understand the purpose behind this (and, to a lesser extend, other non-DF party-oriented instances like Chimera and Hydra), but it seems there must be something better than what we have now.
Two possible solutions (not mutually exclusive):
- Enable DF functionality for Coil, preferrably with some kind of gear check
- Functionality for players to run Coil unlimited number of times per week, with loot lockouts after first attempt (and ideally some other, smaller reward like a modest gil drop, etc.)
Please post your thoughts here, with any feedback on the issue or my comments, or your own take on and experiences with the situation.
Discuss!
Facepalm indeed! I get the impression you don't know what a loot lockout is all about. I didn't at any time say loot lockout by class! The whole point is that you wouldn't be able to roll again on anything, regardless of what job you are on or were on when you get a drop. You get one chance to roll on loot, which is for the stuff that drops on your first weekly run. After that first win, you're done for the week. You would only be able to run it for fun and tomestones, but you are an automatic pass thereafter once the win is flagged for that week. Other games have implemented similar systems with very little effort or issue.
I'm sorry to hear that you don't enjoy helping others. That's one of my favorite parts of the game: being social, meeting new people, and helping those in need. Nothing burns me more than seeing selfishness, apathy, elitism, and meanness in general.
If coil were a repeatable instance with loot lockout, I'd run it as often as I could 1) because I enjoy it and it would be good practice (I've actually really enjoyed T1-4, I guess a lot of people haven't...?), and 2) because I'd want to help as many struggling players as I could to enjoy the game as much as they can.
It's funny that we're all playing a game where we're supposedly the selfless heroes, the "warriors of light," and yet so many of us seem to want to play the villain. Swag and bragging rights aside, I always thought power was something you used to help others, not to lord over them.
So being "elite" is all about scheduling, and not about skill?
I'm fine with the instance taking time, being hard, etc. etc., but make the damn game available when people want to play it. I've got enough things to schedule IRL as you say, I want to be able to hop on the game and run challenging content at my convenience. If no one is on DF running it, thats another story, but at least it should be there.
This isn't about an equality of outcomes -- I don't want the content itself changed in any way to just hand out 'phat lewt'. I'm interested in a greater equality of opportunity to access the actual instance. Its 2013 -- theres no excuse for a system requiring hours of LFP shouts just to get in to the instance.
1) I think you missed the point: I'm ok with loot lockouts, the concern is participation lockouts. Maybe you're trying to say they'd just go back and carry FC members? Not sure. But supposing a gear check was in place I don't see how this would be an issue.
2) If the content is the same, save it's just accessible by DF, how would this change the 'skill check'? Same as any other dungeon, if the party sucks and wipes, u leave or time out and do-over. I don't get how this is even an issue.
I see where we had the disconnect. In my understanding of a loot lockout (in games I've played previously), you lose the right to roll once you've beaten the boss once, regardless if you received the drop or not. It's not just for the player that gets the drop.
As far as the watering down, I don't think it should be changed at all. There's absolutely no harm making the content available for players to try via DF. Ideally there'd be a gear check, so that wouldn't be an issue, but even if there wasn't players could still attempt the content, see where they were lacking, then give it another go once they've shored up their gear and tactics. I would think that would also encourage the use of statics as those players that feel a fixed party would be more efficient connect with like-minded individuals and start running the content together. As it stands, there's no opportunity for that, and it makes for a breeding ground for cliquishness and elitism (copious amounts of which are evident in this thread ^_^;; ).
A month ago I would have agreed, but the few PUGs I've been able to get for coil have been pretty good. Ofc theres a big difference between turn 1 and turn 4, so difficulty does scale, but I think people too easily write off the 'derp finder.'
Agreed. Those times I've been able to get a party, it's been a really enjoyable experience. I don't think it needs dumbing down, I'd just like to see it accessible so people can actually enjoy it without having to spend their entire day LFP or being locked in to a static.
Mixed feelings. One the one hand, yeah. One the other hand, seems redundant with the AF2 system.
This essentially says to me, "It would be hard and people would probably fail, so they shouldn't even offer the content." As I said above, I don't understand this mentality -- why not make it available for people to try? It's difficult, and requires strategy, but I don't think that means you can't be thrown in with a group of new people and learn to beat the instance together. If you don't have the patience to work with new people in a challenging environment, then don't do it, but why restrict others from doing so if they so choose?
It's like SE looked at their options and said, "Ya know, Y2K was great, wasn't it? I bet people really miss LAN parties. Let's make something that feels like that!" Nothing says massively multiplayer like playing the same content, the same way, with the same 7 people, week after week after week.
Why does that mean others need to be locked out? I'm not asking that the content itself be changed or made easier in any way, nor that the amount of loot be modified. If the difference in said 'haves' and 'have-nots' is simply access to a static party, there's something very wrong with the game. I think that's great that the content is designed to be difficult, but if SE wants people to form statics they should rely on the difficulty of the content to incentivize players towards making said statics for the sake of efficiency in their gear farms, and not default to simply locking players out just because it seems the thing to do.