Amdapor Exploit

[Horg]

Was there any proof of an exploit? If there was you can report them. You don't even have to be on the same world as them. Reporting after the fact in regards to someone using an exploit is pretty difficult to prove.

In the AK tree scenario, or any group in which members ask you to use a known exploit, refuse on the grounds that it is an exploit, and if they insist, report them. They will get banned.

The first FC to use the Twintania exploit admitted it, reported it after the kill and looting, according to the TOS they should have been perma-banned on the spot, SE has yet to actually acknowledge or address the FC in question. SE may have been extremely strict in the past, but they are currently showing that you can get away with breaking the TOS with no repercussions...unless you made too much Gil legitimately, then you'll have all your Gil taken away after a week suspension.

[Vodomir]

Exactly. The time it takes to jump up the tree equates to about the same time it takes to burn down the adds. I mean if you are undergeared for AK this is probably helpful but being geared with adequate weapons, the first boss can be burned down quite easily. I honestly think SE has way more to cater to than a simple "bug" for -one- boss in -one- dungeon.

While fixing this bug should probably not be assumed to be on their top priority list, this one should be relatively easy to fix by just not allowing the players to jump those trees (just put invisible walls to where players would otherwise jump onto the tree; the invisible wall mechanic is already in the game).

When not fixing this bug, SE could still bring the message across by simply swinging the ban hammer on people who use this exploit. I know that people will hate me for such a demand and say things like "it isn't really faster" or "it's already easy enough without the exploit" - question remains, why do people insist on using the exploit if it wasn't any easier/faster? The answer is that people using this exploit have obviously not been able to complete this encounter the regular way, so yes, using this explit did give them an advantage. And on the other hand I'd have to say that every exploit should be treated equally as otherwise where would you draw the line, which exploit is considered to be "ok" and which ones are considered to be "bad". Therefore a zero tolerance policy is the only way to ensure the ToS can effectively be enforced.

[Gemma]

I really don't see the problem I've been in parties where some go in the tree and some stay on the ground and its fine. To call it "Game Breaking" is bit of a stretch. Should it be there? maybe, maybe not, but I've never seen anyone force anyone to use this method. If you want to go for it, if you want to stay on the ground np. Not like AK is hard once you know the patterns.

[Sinth]

Some of the groups in question have openly admitted to exploit-killing Twintania and then reported themselves and the exploit only after making use of the exploit.

Discovering a boss exploit and reporting it after the fight is a bit different than learning of a known exploit and intentionally using it to your advantage.

[Vodomir]

Discovering a boss exploit and reporting it after the fight is a bit different than learning of a known exploit and intentionally using it to your advantage.

Knowing of SE's comment on the Chimera/Hydra glitch, which clearly stated that killing an immobilized mob is breaking the ToS and that they expect parties to abort the fight once such a situation is encountered and then finding out how to (reproduceably) bring Twintania to complete halt at 80% health and slaying away at the remaining 80% is not exactly like accidently running across this bug while it was too late to realize. Killing a frozen Twintania with still 80% HP left IS a conscious decision and it's a decision to violate the ToS, thus swinging the ban hammer is more than appropriate. Maybe you should inform yourself on the matter a bit better before even trying to defend such behaviour?

[Sinth]

bla bla bla. aren't you just the moral authority?

[Horg]

They didn't use an exploit specific to Twintania, they used a well known exploit which affects a multitude of bosses in order to bug out twintania, one which SE has already pointed out as an exploit and a bannable offense. The fight turned from constant mechanics and frantically fighting to just sitting there smacking the boss for 80% of the fight. They did not accidentally bug Twintania at 5% and not realize it until after; they purposely did it in order to kill the boss, then they realized they would lose all respect from the community and be banned, so tried to cover their butts by reporting it. Other FCs have done the same thing but tried to hide the fact they exploited.

*edit* By the way, that FC has lost all respect, has been banned from their progression thread but, as far as I know, have not even had their achieves or loot stripped...

[Xayoc]

Knowing of SE's comment on the Chimera/Hydra glitch, which clearly stated that killing an immobilized mob is breaking the ToS and that they expect parties to abort the fight once such a situation is encountered and then finding out how to (reproduceably) bring Twintania to complete halt at 80% health and slaying away at the remaining 80% is not exactly like accidently running across this bug while it was too late to realize. Killing a frozen Twintania with still 80% HP left IS a conscious decision and it's a decision to violate the ToS, thus swinging the ban hammer is more than appropriate. Maybe you should inform yourself on the matter a bit better before even trying to defend such behaviour?

The difference between the Chimera/Hydra/BC Turn 5 bug and this is very clear and distinct. Those bugs make the mob sit there and auto attack at the most, the scripts governing the mob break causing it to not use any advanced abilities and/or progress to more difficult stages. This boss runs through its ENTIRE skill tree even if the healer stands in the tree. The healer still gets hit by Obliterate, Mind Melt, Void Thunder, Void Fire, etc and as such is NOT AN EXPLOIT simply an alternative strategy to make a grind dungeon go a bit faster. This is more akin to standing on the hill on the first boss of Sunken Temple or fighting Chimera on the hill so that ranged are out of elevation of his AoE, legitimate strategies that SE has known about for well over a month and not commented on nor said to the community were bannable exploits.

That being said, if someone does not want to fight the boss this way, no one should make them. Personally this one wouldn't do it because frankly you'd waste more time setting up the fight than just doing it the normal way, the boss is crazy easy as it is and if asked to via a DF AK to do so this one would tell the requester to bugger off.

Finally, this one would like to point out there were several pages of forums claiming that Dark Devices Grinding was also an exploit and a developer later said that it was working as intended.

[Selemar]

Everytime i'm in a group where they tell me to do this.... I go to the support desk tab, report cheating, and fill it out.

[Drex]

Climb the tree is far more harder than the legit way tbh....