Selling HM Runs - Is it against TOS?

[Nuzuchi]

There is no real world money involved or anything outside the games economy.

I fail to see how someone giving another person in-game currency for helping them out being wrong. People are allowed to help for free but when they ask for in-game compensation it magically becomes wrong.

I would like to see SE respond to this so I don't have to hear this in game.

[WinterNights]

Plenty of real-world money is involved as at least some of the customers of these services will have purchased gil. It's only a matter of time before SE intervenes and dishes out bans/suspensions without discrimination. It's already happened to the crafters.

[Xatsh]

Plenty of real-world money is involved as at least some of the customers of these services will have purchased gil. It's only a matter of time before SE intervenes and dishes out bans/suspensions without discrimination. It's already happened to the crafters.

I hate to say it if you ever used the Market Boards... you are involved in RMT money. So by this logic SE should ban 99% of the playerbase for having some rmt gil.

So this is not a reason not to do it... we just have to assume SE will stop being stupid with how they handle this. Ban the seller and direct buyer, but once the money enters the economy past that level it no longer is worthy of banning. Can't arrest a store clerk for selling a candy bar to someone who just robbed a bank and stopped by the corner store while running away.

[Kitya]

Problem not solved. It states real-world money OR value any in-game currency. Do you have something better?

I already explained this earlier in the thread but let me try to be more clear.

It is not stating what you think it is. It's saying you cannot purchase anything with real-world money or real-world value (aka, I could not give someone an i-phone in exchange for a run in game) for anything inside the game. If it were in game currency then every transaction on the market boards would be against the ToS.

[brazendreams]

Problem not solved. It states real-world money OR value any in-game currency. Do you have something better?

You are reading it wrong. It should look like this "You may not sell, purchase or exchange, for real-world money or value, any in-game currency, accounts, characters, in-game services, or in-game virtual items."

So it then reads as it is meant to: (first half) "You may not sell, purchase or exchange" PAUSE (second part) "for real-world money or value" PAUSE (third part) "any in-game currency, accounts, characters, in-game services, or in-game virtual items."

The key phrase is "for real-world money or value". With the way your attempting to read the sentence by linking "any in-game currency" to the "or value" it makes no sense at all as then "currency, accounts, characters, in-game services, or in-game virtual items" would be attached to the declaration of the sentence, and the conditional phase would be missing, making it incomplete.

[Taruranto]

Plenty of real-world money is involved as at least some of the customers of these services will have purchased gil.

You can apply the same logic to ppl purchasing HQ material and equip in the Market Board.

By that logic, do we ban all crafters? Or anyone who used the market boards?

[WinterNights]

Not to mention, with mass-aquisition of gil, comes greed and so-called "legit" players RMT their proceeds. Or the gil-sellers gear themselves up and lvl their toons to get a piece of the action. It happened in FFXI and SE shut it down hard.

[Kn3xis]

You are reading it wrong. It should look like this "You may not sell, purchase or exchange, for real-world money or value, any in-game currency, accounts, characters, in-game services, or in-game virtual items."

Ok this is the clarification I needed. They are missing some punctuation which is what caused the misunderstanding. This isn't the first time things have been translated and not checked for correctness.

[Jasiwel]

Yeah, localizations can be tricky, especially from Japanese to English. Punctuation is very big too because there's a big difference between "Let's eat Grandma!" and "Let's eat, Grandma!"

It's saying that you can't sell services/goods/commodities/gil in-game for real world money basically. This rule is why Gil Selling is illegal.

[dontcare]

People are allowed to help for free but when they ask for in-game compensation it magically becomes wrong.

Because they want it to be wrong. The thought of other players making oodles of gil for little effort doing something they can't inspires envy I'd imagine.