EXPLOIT: Amdapor Keep

[Rurushan]

not a fkn exploit, stop whining and move on.

Would you call it good game design, then? To have all those mobs just there to be avoided? Or are you only saying this because you want instant gratification and are afraid of things changing to actually make sense?

[ThePatriarch]

I don't think MMOs are for you. This is just basic design and does not specifically apply to FFXIV, whether I have been to its endgame or not. If it's BORING, thats one thing, but if its taking up your time, thats working as intended. You don't know what you're getting into if after the 5th or 6th run of the same dungeon you start complaining.

I feel as if you might not have played the other Final Fantasy MMO either

Speedruns, or "Sac" pulling is a "norm" in the realm of FF MMO's. Now I agree with you that skipping everything is a little questionable, but how about they give us a reason to kill the trash mobs, not just using "time" as a reason.

For instance, make them drop gil (very small increments), items to turn in for gear (nothing great, maybe?) or atleast a little incentive to spend the minute or so to kill them. Otherwise people are just going to speed past them

If you did play FFXI, take Dynamis, or Limbus for example. Trash mobs dropped pieces of currency, or just random objects that at the bare minimum put something in your loot pool.

[Rurushan]

I feel as if you might not have played the other Final Fantasy MMO either

Sorry, what I've described is basic design for GOOD mmos.

Edit: to respond to your edit:

I feel as if you might not have played the other Final Fantasy MMO either

Speedruns, or "Sac" pulling is a "norm" in the realm of FF MMO's. Now I agree with you that skipping everything is a little questionable, but how about they give us a reason to kill the trash mobs, not just using "time" as a reason.

For instance, make them drop gil (very small increments), items to turn in for gear (nothing great, maybe?) or atleast a little incentive to spend the minute or so to kill them. Otherwise people are just going to speed past them

Assuming you played FFXI, take Dynamis, or Limbus for example. Trash mobs dropped pieces of currency, or just random objects that at the bare minimum put something in your loot pool.

Well thats what I said. The people crying about this not being an exploit are afraid of it changing because they feel its taking too long. It was flawed in FF11 and its still flawed here. The fix for it is not as simple as implementing a way to force the players to kill everything and I really HOPE that if they DO decide to force players to kill everything, there needs to be incentive to kill them. Unique currency or drops that only enemies from this dungeon can drop, daily quests even that reward you for killing them, increased gil. It's my understanding that besides it taking 'too long' to kill them, they aren't WORTH that time in the player's minds. Some more incentive without rewarding the player TOO much for it would go a long way.

[PrimaDonna]

Anybody that knows about gaming knows that there's give and take in all decisions made / Tank pull like that has an advantage and a disadvantage but how in the world is it an exploit? When I get agro, from a random mob outside of dungeons, I simply run away and loose agro. Is that an exploit? I simply used a mechanic to drop agro and reset a mob and bypassed the intention of my fighting it. If I pull agro in a dungeon and run to the exit before the mob gets me, is that an exploit? I simply avoided combat by escaping. I can on with all sorts of examples but it bothers me that the guy who first posted this is some sort of untrustworthy sore person who seems to think the world isn't fair is on a mission to make it fair for everyone.

[ThePatriarch]

Sorry, what I've described is basic design for GOOD mmos.

Opinion =/= Fact

In the meantime, how about you go level up past 20 and come back to us when you aren't wet behind your ears and debate this further.

Well thats what I said. The people crying about this not being an exploit are afraid of it changing because they feel its taking too long. It was flawed in FF11 and its still flawed here. The fix for it is not as simple as implementing a way to force the players to kill everything and I really HOPE that if they DO decide to force players to kill everything, there needs to be incentive to kill them. Unique currency or drops that only enemies from this dungeon can drop, daily quests even that reward you for killing them, increased gil. It's my understanding that besides it taking 'too long' to kill them, they aren't WORTH that time in the player's minds. Some more incentive without rewarding the player TOO much for it would go a long way.

I agree.

[Rurushan]

Anybody that knows about gaming knows that there's give and take in all decisions made / Tank pull like that has an advantage and a disadvantage but how in the world is it an exploit? When I get agro, from a random mob outside of dungeons, I simply run away and loose agro. Is that an exploit? I simply used a mechanic to drop agro and reset a mob and bypassed the intention of my fighting it. If I pull agro in a dungeon and run to the exit before the mob gets me, is that an exploit? I simply avoided combat by escaping. I can on with all sorts of examples but it bothers me that the guy who first posted this is some sort of untrustworthy sore person who seems to think the world isn't fair is on a mission to make it fair for everyone.

Are you quite aware of what you are saying?

[Rurushan]

Opinion =/= Fact

In the meantime, how about you go level up past 20 and come back to us when you aren't wet behind your ears and debate this further.

Whether or not I like a game is indeed an opinion. Sales are fact, however, and thats what I was talking about. FF11 was successful in its own right though, don't get me wrong. Naturally though if you only know Final Fantasy and nothing else then yeah I guess it must have been really good.

Edit: Oh, and I'll level up when I can log in and play ;o;

[Lemon8or]

eh I've played other games where the tank just run past all trash mobs to get to objectives then either run out of their range to reset aggro or die. It's nothing new.

[Rurushan]

eh I've played other games where the tank just run past all trash mobs to get to objectives then either run out of their range to reset aggro or die. It's nothing new.

But that doesn't make it right. Why do we accept such standards instead of striving for anything better? Its not good game design if players are skipping through content just to get to what is 'important' to them. Everything in-between should have some reasonable value to the player to keep things more interesting and less boring for time invested.

[Sucidaldeathtar]

Keep is hard pose to be and I'm a blm so it's even harder to clear. If you want to exp pick another dungeon. This is for advancing rank and getting items.