PVP gear

[Alhanelem]

Then you are like I am going to step in to arenas and faceroll a bunch of PvP only players because of my superior PvE gear.

Except as I explained, PvP and PvE players typically want different stats from their gear, so what's best for PvE isn't necessarily best for PvP and vice versa. In WoW, you can use any gear anywhere- but the latest raid gear set for each class doesn't beat the latest PvP reward set- It is common, however, for people struggling to progress in PvE to obtain a decent PvP set, which will help them get their foot in the door. At the same time, The best PvE set is geared towards the needs of the PvE player- so it may help get your foot in the door in PvP, but becaue the needs of a PvP player are different, it is not an end-all gear solution.

In other words, PvP in WoW often served a similar role as the Skirmish event in XIV 1.0- not the best stuff, but it can give you that extra push you need to advance to better stuff.

PvP and PvE gear do not have to be seperated, and PvP and PvE should not have seperate levels or anything like that. It destroys the whole point of PvP to many people (seeing how you stack up with all the best stuff you've gotten so far, or using PvP as a testing ground to see how certain things work) The only separation that is needed is interaction- Keeping PvP combatants away from PvE combatants e.g. not letting PvPers ruin a PvE'r's fun or vice versa.

While seperation in all aspects does work from a technical standpoint, it devalues both systems - Fans of PvP feel like they're restricted to only playing PvP becaues it takes time away from PvE without giving them anything they can take out of it, and fans of PvE are left with no incentive to participate. This was the fate of Ballista in FFXI. It was inherently unrewarding, so only a handful of hardcore players kept playing it after the initial newness wore off.

I agree, I should make this very clear im not a PVP ONLY person i love PVE and the story line, i just happen to also like to pvp as well, If they need to delay the relaese of PVP so they make sure PVE is done right im all for that!

PvP will only just begin to go into testing in the final phase of the beta- so it's unlikely that PvP is going to be immediately available at launch.

I honestly have every confidence that YoshiP and the team are handling this with the utmost care.

[Majoga]

I've never really been that big on PvP, the whole idea doesn't make sense to me if it's not faction based. I can see Free Companies declaring war on each other similar to Tera a bit more justified. As far as gear going I don't mind having a separate set for PvP gear and honestly doubt there would be an inventory problem at all over it with saved gear sets not taking up inventory anyways. I can see a tutorial that gives starter gear but after that let other gear be earned/bought with points. Perhaps even Rare drops or crafted items can exist as well. I honestly don't see any problems. I know there will be those that want to fight each other with their PvE sets, so why not make simple game rules "PvP Gear Only", "PvE Gear Only", "All Gear Allowed"? Just my thoughts.

[Ragento]

Generally, pvp players have different stat needs than PvE players. You don't really need to isolate PvE and PvP gear, in large part because what's best for PvP isn't necessarily best for PvE. as long as matchups are sufficiently random, no isolation is required- if the reward is consummate with the difficulty of obtaining it, it will be balanced. If absolutely necessary depending on the item, you can make it so the stats change depending on here the item is used (example: FFXI had many items that gave large stat bonuses but only in certain events, like "+1% waltz potency / Campaign: +10% waltz potency")- Disallowing equipping outside of PvP would be extremely bad, because then you couldn't wear it around and show it off. WoW has never really had an issue with PvE vs PvP gear balance- hardcore raid rewards are always superior to PvP rewards.

oh, and on DaOC: I don't think it was just that one server that had PvP- All servers had PvP, but on the special server it was a totally unrestricted free for all except for new characters.

Because PvP is not going to be open world it doesn't need special servers and it doesn't need special considerations made. As long as no PvP gear is superior to gear that is significantly harder to obtain (e.g. from raids etc), no special exclusions or rules or anything need to be made.

My point about using PvP gear outside of PvP was so that good equips weren't really easy to get for bad players like in wow where bad players would farm PvP all day to get epic pvp gear instead if earning it through normal pve ways, you can still equip your PvP gear outside pvp , but the stats just sent effective enough outside to be very worthwhile.

I also didn't like how peoples high end pve gear was comparable to high end PvP gear in wow, for a skilled player to try burst dmg a high resilance(PvP def) PvP gear wearer, you can prolly fix this issue through algorithm adjustment but I figure avoid the issue all together by making pve gear less effective in pvp

[Lucke]

I remember playing EQ2 and it had open PVP. The way it handled it was each piece of equipment had two sets of stats: PVP and PVE. By default, the stats shown were PVE, but if you click the little "PVP" checkbox, you would see all the stats change to reflect what you can do against another player. This could have changed, it's been a decade since I played lol

We don't need 2 sets of gear, SE could just have PVE and PVP sets of stats for each piece to compensate for player stats. Mobs in the game have much more HP than us, so when you are in PVP, your STR will be lower to compensate for the lower HP for example.

[indira]

every time you see "GEAR" people always want bigger numbers then the other person. thats stupid works in PVE but PVP is broken.

real skill comes from being on the same playing field everyone have the same stuff then you can really pvp. every single MMO pvp is a bad design, horrible. even though theres different gear people end up with wanting the same gear anyways.

[Duelle]

I remember playing EQ2 and it had open PVP. The way it handled it was each piece of equipment had two sets of stats: PVP and PVE. By default, the stats shown were PVE, but if you click the little "PVP" checkbox, you would see all the stats change to reflect what you can do against another player. This could have changed, it's been a decade since I played lol

We don't need 2 sets of gear, SE could just have PVE and PVP sets of stats for each piece to compensate for player stats. Mobs in the game have much more HP than us, so when you are in PVP, your STR will be lower to compensate for the lower HP for example.

That's...a very interesting approach. Would definitely help us get past the thing about gear for PvP and gear for PvE.

[Ragento]

I remember playing EQ2 and it had open PVP. The way it handled it was each piece of equipment had two sets of stats: PVP and PVE. By default, the stats shown were PVE, but if you click the little "PVP" checkbox, you would see all the stats change to reflect what you can do against another player. This could have changed, it's been a decade since I played lol

We don't need 2 sets of gear, SE could just have PVE and PVP sets of stats for each piece to compensate for player stats. Mobs in the game have much more HP than us, so when you are in PVP, your STR will be lower to compensate for the lower HP for example.

It may be a good idea and a unique one at that I can't help but think that it might take away from the feeling of earning PvP gear through skill and hard work, being able to show off my hard earned gear was great and knowing I prolly have to be skillful to earn it unlike some pve gear, ie your party carrying you

[stanleyyoung]

I remember playing EQ2 and it had open PVP. The way it handled it was each piece of equipment had two sets of stats: PVP and PVE. By default, the stats shown were PVE, but if you click the little "PVP" checkbox, you would see all the stats change to reflect what you can do against another player. This could have changed, it's been a decade since I played lol

We don't need 2 sets of gear, SE could just have PVE and PVP sets of stats for each piece to compensate for player stats. Mobs in the game have much more HP than us, so when you are in PVP, your STR will be lower to compensate for the lower HP for example.

If SE did this with gear then i would be fine with it then having them create gear for pvp and pve since that will be loads of work for them. i personally do not want to be held back/restricted in anyway shape or form when i do pve due to pvp and vice versa for all the ppl that wanna do pvp it would suck if they are held back by pve.

honestly i don't really have too much of an interest in doing pvp but being held back on both sides sucks and im not too sure if the abilities would have to be adjusted when someone does pve or pvp. i vaguely remember ppl saying in past threads about abilities for pve would be nerfed/adjusted/held back due to pvp limitations and balancing needs, if it wouldn't be a huge project for SE to not only have the gear with pve & pvp stats but each jobs abilities are set when used in pve or pvp. i kinda remember something about this when ppl first demanded pvp in the first place were the argument was about the abilites effects how they will be over or under powered since SE will have to designed them with both pve & pvp in mind.

[Ragento]

every time you see "GEAR" people always want bigger numbers then the other person. thats stupid works in PVE but PVP is broken.

real skill comes from being on the same playing field everyone have the same stuff then you can really pvp. every single MMO pvp is a bad design, horrible. even though theres different gear people end up with wanting the same gear anyways.

I agree, my idea was also to try and come up to a solution to what you mentioned , to make skill and smarts(preperation) the deciding factor to a fight and not being able to burst DPS via button smashing with pve gear on

[Ragento]

If SE did this with gear then i would be fine with it then having them create gear for pvp and pve since that will be loads of work for them. i personally do not want to be held back/restricted in anyway shape or form when i do pve due to pvp and vice versa for all the ppl that wanna do pvp it would suck if they are held back by pve.

honestly i don't really have too much of an interest in doing pvp but being held back on both sides sucks and im not too sure if the abilities would have to be adjusted when someone does pve or pvp. i vaguely remember ppl saying in past threads about abilities for pve would be nerfed/adjusted/held back due to pvp limitations and balancing needs, if it wouldn't be a huge project for SE to not only have the gear with pve & pvp stats but each jobs abilities are set when used in pve or pvp. i kinda remember something about this when ppl first demanded pvp in the first place were the argument was about the abilites effects how they will be over or under powered since SE will have to designed them with both pve & pvp in mind.

Yoshi-p stated that PvP would be done in a way that it would not put you at a disadvantage if you do not wish to do pvp , I have the utmost faith that yoshi will do it right, and if you have PvP desperate from pve you won't have to worry about adjustments to jobs to balance for PvP effecting pave gameplay Cuz it would only change the PvP part, the pve part would remain unchanged