Time Mage Awareness

[dragnorak]

blm already has flare if anything you could give blm ultima as a limit break

[Hiruke]

Actually Black mage should have Flare as their last tier spell... Whatever though. maybe Dev team could give Time Mage a Black Hole type spell to replace Meteor if Black mages are so set to have that spell.

X-Zone, baby! Some of you cats don't dig too much for your ideas, I guess. And since we've already seen BLM throw down a meteor in a trailer, I don't think it's really a "BLMs super want Meteor so I guess we can let those crybabies have it" so much as a "hey look BLMs already have Meteor, or at least Comet or whatever". And Flare as the ultimate BLM spell... what?

That all aside! The rest is just general comments to the thread in general:

Speculating on what would/wouldn't work in 1.0 is ridiculous. 2.0 is going to be a radically different game. It would be like saying stuff that wouldn't work in FF11 wouldn't work in FF14, so we shouldn't have it. Don't expect the limiting game systems or whatever else to still exist, like... we could only have so many abilities in 1.0 so there's NO WAY blah blah could work in 2.0!

Speculating on 2.0 is also ridiculous, in terms of what would/wouldn't work, or how it should work. I suspect that RDM, for example, is not going to be terribly similar to the RDM we saw in FF11. I'm not for/against Time Mage, but I guarantee you that if the FF14 team decides they want to do any particular job, they will be able to think of a way to stylize it in a way that it doesn't ridiculously overlap another job... What would be the point otherwise?

Also, please stop suggesting jobs as classes. Like, Time Mage should be the class and Red Mage should be the job... What? That's like the goof who was saying Thief should turn into Ninja, when ideally all of the jobs should be stylized, and not branching out of each other. That's like saying White Mage should be the class and Paladin should be the job. No thank you!

tl;dr ver.: Speculation is pointless. The dev team should be more than capable of making any classic FF job into a unique and stylized addition to FF14 without significant overlap of other jobs, and any such additions are not likely to fit the mold of your preconceived notions or wish lists of any particular job (BRD should have made that super clear).

[Mudd]

I personally wouldn't like RDM in XIV. A jack of all trades has no place in an MMO.

What.. That's almost every battle class.

[Altena]

This is starting to become one of those boring threads where people repeat information over and over without actually making any points. I will dot point mine so they are nice and clear, easy to read and so the garbage arguments (on both sides) aren't repeated over and over.

- The spellset that was listed, has very little utility in it's original, FF lore form, if it is not already tied to / can be given to other jobs.

- Enfeebs can easily become unbalanced and overpowered in general, especially "time" based magic which causes the enemy to stop performing actions, or speeds up the player's ability to perform actions. This, in any MMO can be considered heavily overpowered if not done correctly.

- If someone wishes to become a haste bot so I can kill stuff faster on my melee, by all means I welcome it.

- I would rather see RDM branch and and become that "melee mage/support" job instead of a haste bot. This being said I truly hope the focus is on their self buffs such as En- and damage spikes, tied with fast auto-attack and decently heavy weapon skills, rather then the whole haste/refresh/enfeeb bot. Boring class was boring in party play.

- While some people are ignoring the fact that I have stated multiple times, that if done correctly, the job may be viable and wouldn't disagree with implementing it, however taking priority over more traditional FF jobs is blasphemy. The jobs I am talking about are: Red Mage, Dark Knight, Blue Mage, Corsair/Musketeer, Thief, Ninja, Samurai.... To name a few.

Release the jobs I just listed, then I will listen/care about releasing niche/hybrid jobs such as Time Mage.

[Endigiont]

Red mage and Time mage aren't competing for the same spot in the least and I'm unsure why so much argument about it continues. I'm not going to go into depth about the differences I'd suggest going back and playing some old games.

If anyone had read the post I linked to (Foolish I know) I stated I fully anticipated other jobs way before Time Mage.

As for people declaring stuns(stop), hastes and reflects are too OP that is kinda small minded(Almost an old Tanaka we can't give them anything mindset) Stop can be just a couple of seconds to stun enemies, Reflect could be a quick cast long cooldown spell used in tricky situations to help a tank out if an enemy is about to land a huge spell (Not all the damage has to be sent back to them just a percentage of it) As for stop alot of bosses could just be immune to it, remember back in the day when old FF bosses were randomly immune to a ton of enfeebling magic?


One way I see Time Mage being implemented would be a crowd control support job.

For instance you're in a dungeon there's a large group of enemies have the Time Mage cast Gravity on them as the tank pulls out one or two to fight without gravity on them, then he casts Haste on his party and slow and Age(Old) on the enemy (to decrease their attack speed and lower their stats over time), then some of the gravity'd enemies get closer so he binds them giving the party more time to take on the mobs. Maybe he even has a long cooldown expensive magic spell like Comet to deal some damage every other battle or so. Maybe they were fighting Bombs, and while the Bomb was casting self destruct the Time Mage used Stop to momentarily stun and prevent the blast from ravaging your party. Maybe someone had to leave and you invited someone new and had the Time Mage spawn a portal at their location to pick them up.

I mean these are all things possible and being done in other games, nothing is game breaking nothing encroaches on other jobs.


EDIT:

- While some people are ignoring the fact that I have stated multiple times, that if done correctly, the job may be viable and wouldn't disagree with implementing it, however taking priority over more traditional FF jobs is blasphemy. The jobs I am talking about are: Red Mage, Dark Knight, Blue Mage, Corsair/Musketeer, Thief, Ninja, Samurai.... To name a few.

Oh yeah? Corsair/Musketeer is a traditional Final Fantasy job? Since when? Enlighten me. As for all the coloured mages I agree we need them all in the game, as for my post I stated I fully expected and anticipated Thief, Ninja and Samurai to be implemented first (With the lack of Thief being a grievious Final Fantasy sin in my opinion. How many main characters were Thief? A ton.)

- The spellset that was listed, has very little utility in it's original, FF lore form, if it is not already tied to / can be given to other jobs.

Warps, and Teleports are utility, and since when has anyone cared about classes not having utility, there is practically none of what is known as traditional MMORPG utility in FFXIV or FFXI at all. Utility is generally none combat. As for float that could also be considered a utility (Slow fall) however I don't see a use for it and didn't list it since we will only be jumping over small little cliffs.

[Aerenvel]

You said...

Slow- pretty sure this is gonna be an ARC spell
An Archer spell...?
I'm going to go ahead and assume that you meant Arcanist. Regardless of whether or not this ends up in Arcanist's arsenal, it's still Time Magic.

Immobilize - Same thing as bind
So what if it is the same thing as Bind? The current version of the game has a few spells that are capable of inflicting the effect, but we don't have anything quite so direct and dependent on combo/TP.

Reflect - wont happen in a mmo unless the buff last like 2 secs
Who said a buff can't last two seconds? Completely viable spell.

Disable - players can do that with ws curently (wont know if possible in ARR)
Your argument is that because the effect is interwoven into a Weaponskill currently, a more direct version of the effect should not exist. The lack of logic in your arguments continues to astound me.

Vanish- useless
Because Sneak and Invisible in XI were so gosh-darn useless in XI, right? Who needs mob evasion anyway... /sarcasm.

Gravity- in game alrdy
We have a spell called "Gravity" in our game already...? A spell that attempts to directly inflict the effect of WEIGHT onto the target...? Why was I not informed...

Haste- wont be in game
Please continue with your prophetic tellings of how things will be in the future...
It brings me much amusement.

Stop- too OP
You - too narrow-minded. There is more to a spell than just the damage/status it inflicts on the target. Variables like duration/cooldown/cost/resistance and other constraints such as the spell needing to be combo'd for the effect to proc are all aspects that are taken into consideration when creating game balance.

Bleed-this is in the game as well and CNJ still has the effect from aero in ARR as seen in the Live letter 3
Once again, you're arguing that because the effect is interwoven into existing spells, a spell that inflicts the effect in a more direct manner should not exist...?

Break- would be to too OP or too useless
Such bold statements you make. Have you played any other FF before?
1. Inflicting Break does not count as a KO, and thus, does not reward items/gil/experience.
2. Break is an enfeeble that inflicts "Petrify" for a short period of time, which is essentially Immobilize and Disable, but unlike Stop, you cannot inflict damage on the Petrified target.
It's a spell that inflicts a status with unique properties.

Float- could be useful
Yes... I suppose a spell that completely or even partially nullifies Earth magic "could be useful".
...
If you start thinking any funny stuff (such as the spell being too "OP"), look back to the statements I made in reply to your argument against the Stop spell.

Vanishga- useless
Because inflicting the effect of Invisible on the entire party is useless...
Tell us more, oh wise one.

Warp- another useless spell that would not work on mobs
Who said the spell had to target mobs?

Reflectga- same as reflect
Slowga- same as slow
Graviga- same as Gravity
Narrow-minded to the end...

Hastega- this wont be in game also
There you go again, with your prophetic visions...

Drain- this was a thm spell
And...?

Reverse- not even time magic at all
Um.. What...

Bubble- not even time magic
Because Mana Shield was not a Time Mage thing... Right...?

Syphon- was an thm spell before as well
And...?

Undo- LOL
I suppose the idea of removing the last inflicted enfeeble from a target is laughable to you.

Comet- Yeah right
A spell that inflicts massive non-elemental damage in an AoE and is affiliated with time/space...? What's so "yeah right" about that?

Meteorite - Limit break for blm <.<
In Final Fantasy Tactics, the description for this spell reads "Time magic that warps space-time, causing an enormous meteor to fall on the battlefield."
Just another spell that's way more iconic of Time Mage being placed on a class that's hardly deserving of it.

All you have presented is evidence of your own closed-mindedness and a plethora of flawed logic.
I recommend thinking more carefully before posting in future.

Like i said they can get short charge quick control and speed up the pace of over all combat
fill limit gauge faster etc there is many more ways to do things.
dont limit others to that of your own abilities.
also if you looked at my class branch approach this is another option thm/tmg thm/blm
gld/pld gld/drk mar/bsm mar/war con/sch con/whm arc/rng arc/brd lnc/drg lnc/sam then bring another /thf /nin etc or maybe ronin or w/e base class for sam i dunno but come up with ideas.
not complaints only be positive.

[Alerith]

- While some people are ignoring the fact that I have stated multiple times, that if done correctly, the job may be viable and wouldn't disagree with implementing it, however taking priority over more traditional FF jobs is blasphemy. The jobs I am talking about are: Red Mage, Dark Knight, Blue Mage, Corsair/Musketeer, Thief, Ninja, Samurai.... To name a few.

Release the jobs I just listed, then I will listen/care about releasing niche/hybrid jobs such as Time Mage.

All I really get out of this is "Time Mage is ok with me as long as they release the jobs I want first."

Time Mage is a traditional FF job as well, so what's the issue? Because it hasn't appear in AS MANY games as the other listed?

Also, I'm failing to see any truly concerning points in your argument.
-You say "Haste Bot". Speculation.
-You say "Unbalanced." Speculation.
-You're saying Red Mage over Time Mage when they are completely different jobs and have totally separate roles, especially when you specify a focus on Enspells, auto-attacks and weaponskills, which Time Mage wouldn't have.
-You say "Haste/Refresh/Enfeeb bot" which tells me you don't know Red Mage outside of FFXI, which is tragic.

[Altena]

If there were ever a listing for misinformed and completely off-base posts, yours and Altena's would be way up there. No offense, but this list and your reasoning are both horseshit, guys.

As for you, your attempt at insults and defaming is laughable. You do not have the diplomatic power to decide whose reasoning is "hoseshit" and whose is not. While reasons can be different, opinions will never determine which of those reasons are "hoseshit" or not. Try again.

<insert boring list that doesn't "fix" anything here>

OK re-writing that list was boring and time-consuming, but the point is there are PLENTY of reasons why if they plan for it, Time Mage or any other class/job for that matter could work easily in the framework of 2.0 which, because apparently certain individuals need to be reminded, is going to have a very, VERY different set of rules.

Next time, don't bother re-writing that list because you basically explained abilities everyone already knows, and wasted your time.

As for 2.0, I don't get why everyone is making the argument that we are blind rabbits and have no idea what is going on. It is pretty obvious that the battle system is getting overhauled in a functional sense (animation lock reduction, some major job reworks etc) but as a whole, it is still going to be the same game essentially. Combo system is staying but being modified, classes are being reworked, battle regimes are being reimplemented... What this has to do with changing the effectiveness of certain spells that are deemed to be either useless or OP (by my standards) is beyond me to be honest.

Just a small example is "Stop" "Immobilize" "Disable". Preventing a boss from performing any action for any duration of time has a high chance of being OP in any battle system... It also seems that everyone including yourself is putting a heavy weight on these being the main point of a "Time Mage". Look at that ability list again... You padded out 3 spells that do almost exactly the same thing. The only spells that you did mention have been given to Red Mage/Black Mage/White mage in previous FF's (not just XI, which is not where I have been basing my points off anyway). These spells are: Slow (red mage/white mage), reflect (white mage), vanish/blink (white mage), gravity (black mage/red mage), haste (red mage/BLACK mage actually).

While sure they are "time/space" based spells, implementing a whole job based around a few buff spells seems like a waste of resources. Spend that time on Dark Knight, or Blue Mage (an actual unique mage), Musketeer/Corsair... etc

[Endigiont]

Just a small example is "Stop" "Immobilize" "Disable". Preventing a boss from performing any action for any duration of time has a high chance of being OP in any battle system...

As I've and others have stated Bosses can be immune to stuns and in most Final Fantasy games are immune to most if not all status ailments.

EDIT:

You padded out 3 spells that do almost exactly the same thing.

Crowd Control
Bind - Crowd control prevent movement
Gravity - Crowd control slows movement
Stop - Crowd control stuns target

Enfeeble
Slow - Enfeeble, increases delay for attacks / abilities
Old - Enfeeble decreases stats over time

Support
Haste - Buff decreases delay for attacks / abilities
Reflect - Bounces a spell back at it's caster

Utility
Teleport - Utility brings other players to Time Mage's location
Vanish - Sneak / Invis

Damage
Comet - Nuke

[Alerith]

As I've and others have stated Bosses can be immune to stuns and in most Final Fantasy games are immune to most if not all status ailments.

Indeed.

It's like saying "They shouldn't implement a Death spell because killing bosses with one spell will be too OP." Resistances and Immunities can be adjusted for bosses.

Even on basic spells. Say Slow is a 10% slow and Slow II is a 15% slow. Adjust Ifrit's resistances so it's 5% slow for Slow I and 8-10% for Slow II.