Marriage feedback [inofficial Poll]

[Zantetsuken]

Here's what I think.
Yes, allow it. I would dearly love to be able to marry my irl boyfriend in game, however, he picked a pretty catgirl, same as I did. I don't think either one of us plans on changing, and I imagine a LOT of other people are probably in the same situation.
Don't call it marrage, as that has super special meaning for Christians and such. Give it another name, like the ones suggested earlier in the thread. Say you have it enabled, weddings, happy party union times, the whole nine yards, but don't specify if it's one, the other, or both. If you don't like it, don't try to marry your best friend to see if it works, or you are stuck together for a good long time. ;P
Make a devorce quest, make it as expencive as can be. Make people think twice about having their unions. Make sure that they know what they are getting into, then we don't have people complaining about the above situation, and if they do go through with it then, they deserved it. :P
And hell, even if SE DOESN'T want to make it so GMs go over the cerimonies, at LEAST give us the option to craft the things needed. Then, people can have a cerimony where ever the crap they want to. Doesn't even have to be the specified happy union building.

I totally understand the big deal, it could backfire massivly [...]

I think your proposal is the best route - let the whole thing be player driven.

The sticky part of this is the word: 'Marraige/結婚/Heirat/Mariage/Matrimonio/결혼' - Most people opposed to same-sex marriage don't fuss much over legal equivalents (ie domestic partnerships)

If it does end up being a GM/NPC sanctioned event, SE had best come their own term: 'Soul Pairing/Love Pact/BFF Certificate/etc..'

Marriage a silly gimmick in an MMO anyways (gonna consummate that?)

[KiriA500]

BFF Certificate

I want a BFF Certificate!

[Arcell]

huh?

By that logic, you wouldn't complain if there was positive depictions of slavery, sexism, or heck even child pornograpy in a game?

I mean, its fake after all.


(In before fallacious derailment attempt: "You're comparing same-sex marriage to child pornography??!!".)

Slavery and sexism depend on the game. If it takes place in a time period or country where these things are accepted, then that is the culture of the world the game is set in. Do I agree with it? Nope. Do real world rules apply and make it illegal? Nope.

Child pornography is way different though as that is about mere depiction. The depiction of slavery or sexism or same sex marriage is not illegal.

By your logic are you not okay with killing humanoid enemies as it is murder? I mean just because it's fake doesn't make it okay, right?

[Huginn]

Either I missed something since last night or I've been sorely misinformed because I'm fairly certain it doesn't work that way.

At any rate, this thread is about same sex marriage in a game. Fake, non-official, non-legal marriage in an online game. Someone tell me why same sex marriages shouldn't be allowed in that context.

The real world has no bearing here, especially because the gender of the players is not taken into consideration, only the gender of the characters. Two male players with opposite gender characters can get married. A male and a female player with same gender characters cannot get married.

you did miss something and it was not very obvious unless you spent several hours poring over the thread. The message was trying to show that faith is, by definition, not a choice in the same way that sexual preference is not a choice. Just as believing that 1x+1x=5x (where x is a non zero, real number) is not a choice.

I'm not angry, I'm disappointed.
This is a honest discussion about the inclusion of same sex marriage in a MMO, not a place for your (bad) comedy routine. That is all I'm saying to you.

You were the one claiming that religion is simply a choice in the same manner that some claim sexual preference is a choice. If you want to keep the subject to same sex marriage in a video game, stop bringing up other topics, namely religion outside of video games. I disagree with your assertion that faith is a choice.

my point is to show that your selective moral outrage is quite ridiculous. Should we also be petitioning for minors to be permitted to marry in game, whether it be their character or the player that is a child, while marriage does not even exist in the game?

[Orophin]

I got to this thread a bit late (it was already 47 pages by the time I looked at it!) and tried to go through it all, but it's just more time than I want to invest going through it all. I took a couple earlier posts and quoted them just to give my input on the subject.

First of all, I just want to say I'm neither for or against same-sex marriage. I'm not a religious person and I'm also not a person who even wants to get married. My beliefs on being with someone is at some point you will find someone you will want to spend the rest of your life with, and I think just making that commitment to that person who is also of the same mind should be good enough. You shouldn't have to go through a government facility to make anything "official".

As others have mentioned, with how the shift in views of society are these days, for the sake of fairness if they can't include same-sex marriage in-game they just shouldn't do it at all.

Now to my quotes:

I think they could dodge a lot of bullets if they didn't call it 'marriage' but tried a different name like bonding, handfasting, pairing etc then allowing the same sex union.

I'm not against same sex marriage at all, but it'd kinda shy away from the stigma of folks getting their underwear in a twist over marriage not being shown in a traditional (to them) light.

Personally I would love to see same sex unions, as one poster mentioned earlier; there are a lot of people who play characters that don't properly reflect their r/l gender, so to leave them out of something like this based on aesthetic choice wouldn't be cool.

This might be a compromising way of tackling it, but it kind of seems like a halfway measure to appease the people who are against same-sex marriage.

This is a classic example of making an issue of something that really didn't need to be a issue.

If Yoshi P's answer would have been a nonchalant "Of course you can." we would have no thread no debate no moral righteousness.. everyone would just go on with their day.

If marriage is only limited to M/F pairings i would like a real life gender check... (pics or it didn't happen rules apply) if we are bring real world debates into a virtual one might as well bring it all in or nothing.

Can we talk about cross species marriages now?

The gender check would be kinda interesting, but also invasive at the same time. It could be done, but who's to say someone isn't using their mom's credit card and is getting married to their guy friend? Just what ifs, since I think most of the people that would take part in this are probably older and have their own financials taken care of. You'd be more likely to see a Male Roegadyn and a Female Lalafell getting married than this happening. (to answer your second question)

Im a christian and im also VERY bisexual. I hope im not going to hell D: No one told me this ; ;

It's not my place to judge anyone, but I just wanted to point you in the direction of this, since your question piqued my interest and I wanted to look it up:

The Bible doesn't speak of homosexuality very often, but when it does, it condemns it as sin. Let's take a look.

Lev. 18:22 , "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination."

Lev. 20:13 , "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltness is upon them"

Cor. 6:9-10 , "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, 10nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God."

Rom. 1:26-28 , "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, 27and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error. 28And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper."

source: http://carm.org/bible-homosexuality

As I mentioned before, I'm not a very religious person so my view on things may not be correct, but is there really any grey area to be had here? I would think a book of words from the God you worship should be black and white. It's one thing to follow everything else to a T but exclude one bit which seems to be damning.

I hope you don't take the above as offensive; I was trying to be objective as possible about it, as religion is a very touchy subject, and is usually one to get a thread locked. I was just hoping to get your view on this.

[Reika]

I think your proposal is the best route - let the whole thing be player driven.

The sticky part of this is the word: 'Marraige/結婚/Heirat/Mariage/Matrimonio/결혼' - Most people opposed to same-sex marriage don't fuss much over legal equivalents (ie domestic partnerships)

If it does end up being a GM/NPC sanctioned event, SE had best come their own term: 'Soul Pairing/Love Pact/BFF Certificate/etc..'

Marriage a silly gimmick in an MMO anyways (gonna consummate that?)

I think calling it something else would put it under the radar too. There are other ways too.

[Huginn]

I want a BFF Certificate!

Platinum Paramour's Pendant?

OH NOES!!! that event made it possible to receive the achievements for Valentione's day with a same sex partner! you could even achieve "Player Name has been recognized as a member of Eorzea's most loving couple during Valentione's Day!" with a same sex partner. In fact, some in my linkshell did manage to do so with a same sex couple.

[KiriA500]

The message was trying to show that faith is, by definition, not a choice in the same way that sexual preference is not a choice. Just as believing that 1x+1x=5x (where x is a non zero, real number) is not a choice.

Just stop. You have no clue what you're talking about, and you prove it with nonsense like this.

[Huginn]

Just stop. You have no clue what you're talking about, and you prove it with nonsense like this.

Just what do you mean? you say i have no clue as to what i am talking about. i assume you mean that you believe that faith is a choice and therefor anyone who disagrees with you has no clue? if this is the case, then i ask you why you do not choose to believe the opposite of what you currently believe. If you are a theist then why not just choose to believe that there is no God or gods? if you are an athiest then why not just choose to believe that there is a God or gods?

[Haibel]

Oh FFS! Just make a damn Player Poll that offical. Which should have been done before planning to put marriage
in.

Do you want player marriages? Y/N

Do you want same gender player marriages? Y/N

would you still want player marriages if same gender was not allowed? Y/N


No BS with it, 51% of total Polled wins.