"The Adventures of RNG!" Top 3 Hamlet Provisioner

[Krausus]

Again, where did I say I won't put in the time? And by the way, I've spent more time in hamlets than those walking around with relics...in part, cause I'm being nice and making sure EVERYONE gets a seal, and not just 'the progression team'.

The underlying point of this post IS NOT:
Hamlets are hard (they are not, we don't even need a top 20 in our group to consistantly get 60K+battles) Yes, they require a bit of learning in the very beginning, but it's not rocket science.

nor is the point:

I want my seals immediately! Again, I don't mind a grind to an extent. The complaints start to happen when you've spend close to 2 months in game doing the same thing over and over...and still have 1-2 months left before you are done. And this is just one step... the EASY step.

The points the OP and several of us were trying to make were these:

1. If you work hard as an individual or a group to get a top 3 provisioner, 4-6 hours of hamlet grinding should = about 2 seals for that. As most people don't play for more than 6 hours, it is a reasonable expectation that something meant to speed up a process (getting seals) actually should. The whole 'you didn't play long enough' is silly talk. If we would be able to grind hamlets 10-16 hours a day every day, we wouldn't need the boost in seals from having a top provisioner in the first place. (Also, while Scy probably didn't update his OP, he DID end up grinding 13 hamlets...he got 2/13 and it took about 7 hours of his life)

2. The time required in general to get 8 people 9/9 on seals is a bit much. No matter how you look at it, awesome luck =42 hours of grinding (this is a assuming one drop per run)...a more practical number is 85ish hours (using a 50% drop rate). The point most people are missing is while yes, the seals go to the individual and while yes, we individiually need them as turn ins for the quest, the quest 'A Relic Reborn' requires a full party. You can't earn your weapon by yourself. You'll need a group.

3. We are not saying we wish for an 'easy button'. Our group is Hamleting everyday. To the point I'd argue people are getting testy with eachother because they are sick of this whole hamlet grind thing. Some of them have over 200 hamlet runs in...and 6ish seals. 200 Hamlet clears are typically not done by people who 'aren't willing to work'

Look, if in the next patch, SE made the drop rate the same as the 'Helm no one wants' or 1 every run, it wouldn't hurt the elite at all. There are still so many hurdles in the quest that will trip up the less experienced and skilled that being all high and mighty is a waste of time.

TL: DR I've put in more time towards relic already than those walking around on my server with the actual relic weapon. No one was complaining about the difficulty, just the lack of reward for a provisioner status based.

an extra 25% chance to get a seal is pretty significant but its still 25% meaning you have a 75% chance to not get one. Bad luck is bad luck it sucks but does it need to change? I don't think so this step is what is gonna determine if you have it in you in the first place.

[Judge_Xero]

an extra 25% chance to get a seal is pretty significant but its still 25% meaning you have a 75% chance to not get one. Bad luck is bad luck it sucks but does it need to change? I don't think so this step is what is gonna determine if you have it in you in the first place.

Just going to start with....RNG/Grind has nothing to do with whether someone is able to beat Ifrit Extreme/Garuda/AV,CC 17 minute runs, so therefore your statement is false. Unless you mean it in some other context, which is possible.

I agree the RNG system is brutal and the Hamlet design could be tweaked to reward more effort as well.
(Token drops to trade for seals, when over 65k, and it takes 50 tokens for 1 seal)

1) Without the competition to top 3 positions, Hamlet Levels will not benefit. This is a community issue. If people are not willing to work together for a common goal, they will most definately compete for the greatest prize (#1 Provisioner)
2) If say, Lvl 2 Hamlet guaranteed seals each and every run, but required 100 Million points to reach, after 1 month, if the community could even cooperate to build that many points and 50% of the population got their seals, the other 50% would be SOL.

Now would it be better to have seals available for maybe, the top 10 Provisioners?
Scaling it down by 10% ranges wouldn't work (100% would essentially be the same as 60% over 10 runs. So 5 top positions
to fairly easily get seals)

Maybe 10 top spots for seals, but 100%,70%,50%,25%, ---10% for Provisioner 5 to 10.

I do feel bad for the OP, as he is my LS mate, but in the bigger picture, what about the 4th provisioner @ 1.1Mil, 5th Provisioner @ 900k.... they didn't get to even battle the RNG, for a similar effort.

[TheVedis]

Just going to start with....RNG/Grind has nothing to do with whether someone is able to beat Ifrit Extreme/Garuda/AV,CC 17 minute runs, so therefore your statement is false. Unless you mean it in some other context, which is possible.

I agree the RNG system is brutal. But the Hamlet design works:

1) Without the competition to top 3 positions, Hamlet Levels will not benefit. This is a community issue. If people are not willing to work together for a common goal, they will most definately compete for the greatest prize (#1 Provisioner)
2) If say, Lvl 2 Hamlet guaranteed seals each and every run, but required 100 Million points to reach, after 1 month, if the community could even cooperate to build that many points and 50% of the population got their seals, the other 50% would be SOL.

Now would it be better to have seals available for maybe, the top 10 Provisioners?
Scaling it down by 10% ranges wouldn't work (100% would essentially be the same as 60% over 10 runs. So 5 top positions
to fairly easily get seals)

Maybe 10 top spots for seals, but 100%,70%,50%,25%, ---10% for Provisioner 5 to 10.

I do feel bad for the OP, as he is my LS mate, but in the bigger picture, what about the 4th provisioner @ 1.1Mil, 5th Provisioner @ 900k.... they didn't get to even battle the RNG, for a similar effort.

the system as is isnt the issue
again, you seem to think you NEED to have a provisioner to make progress, you dont
the problem is, without one, you DO NEED SKILL to steadily get 60k points per run

yes, skill, challenge, something everyone is denying that is needed to do this

and time, yes, you need time, and if you dont have time for this, you dont have time for 17 minute runs, cuz you dont have time to practice to get to the point of doing them

[Eagleheart]

Here is a good quote that illustrates Vedis' incapacity to understand the issue being brought to topic in this thread.

another thing they will not understand

my group isnt even at those stages yet, but i already know what we are in for, and its gonna take a LONG time
we have 30 people looking forward to that, and not a single one of us has any misconception about what we are looking at, or a complaint about what we are doing now or whats ahead

we understand the whole point of this quest and obtaining these items, which is something it seems alot of people in these forums lack

Nothing about mastering Garuda speed run, Ifrit Extreme, or time attack AV/CC has to do with the problem of Provisioner and irritating drop rates when you have completed the event as required.

If you complete AV/CC 17 minute, you get your item.

If you complete Garuda speed run, you complete the task.

If you complete Ifrit Extreme, you complete the task.

If you complete HamDef 60k+, you might, if you are very fortunate, get your item, but probably not.

♪ One of these things is not like the others, one of these things does not belong~~~♪

[TheVedis]

Here is a good quote that illustrates Vedis' incapacity to understand the issue being brought to topic in this thread.



Nothing about mastering Garuda speed run, Ifrit Extreme, or time attack AV/CC has to do with the problem of Provisioner and irritating drop rates when you have completed the event as required.

If you complete AV/CC 17 minute, you get your item.

If you complete Garuda speed run, you complete the task.

If you complete Ifrit Extreme, you complete the task.

If you complete HamDef 60k+, you might, if you are very fortunate, get your item, but probably.

♪ One of these things is not like the others, one of these things does not belong~~~♪

you act like those are easy feats to do though

look at the difficulty of the hamlet end compared to 17 minute runs and ifrit

HUGE difference, you get rewarded based on difficulty


really hard to do = full credit
easier to do = partial credit


you guys keep throwing in the fact you get auto successes later, but the fact remains most people who cant get seals, or are whining about it, will never complete those later sets cuz they dont have the skill required to do so

[Eagleheart]

if skill isnt needed why do people rage so much about "requiring" top 3s and top 20s and how hard it is to do that cuz they cant get 60k without it

that sounds like a challenge to me, and skill needed to keep 60k without

but make excuses, keep blaming others for the fact you cant get seals, or gear

or do what some do also, ignore the gear drops completely cuz seals are all that matter

It isn't difficult to get 60k without Top3. Top3 should be more helpful than it is.

Frankly, being a provisioner should be more helpful than it is, period. That is the substance of the topic.

No one really cares that greatly about the equipment from Hamlet. I'm relatively certain that folks go into Hamlet, yourself included, with little consideration of the gear drops, but rather, with their eye on the prize, that being Curtana, Gae Bolg, et cetera.

you act like those are easy feats to do though

look at the difficulty of the hamlet end compared to 17 minute runs and ifrit

HUGE difference, you get rewarded based on difficulty

And now you dodge the point of the matter upon abruptly realizing what is actually being said. A nifty attempt at a dodge, but no dice.

you guys keep throwing in the fact you get auto successes later, but the fact remains most people who cant get seals, or are whining about it, will never complete those later sets cuz they dont have the skill required to do so

The whole "if you can't get seals you are unskilled" thing was funny the first dozen posts, but it's kind of getting old now.

I understand that you're obsessed with justifying your ego. I don't really care. (>.> ) If you're so comfortable with the system as it is, why do you care if it changes for the better for other folks? Does it somehow take away from your sense of accomplishment?

Were you one of those folks who quit XI due to Abyssea 'erasing all your hard work'?

[Eagleheart]

the time and frustration it takes to get seals and the time and frustration it takes to master the other content is comparable.

You know for someone that spouts "commonsense" so much I would think I wouldn't have to explain that. Humph imagine that.

The two are not comparable, especially considering how each successive victory in the Vale, or Cutter's, or Garuda/Ifrit EX are to the benefit of all present, and not one (or two) every other run.

I would think that a person would put a little more effort into their replies on a topic like this than "oh yeah?! Well... you're a jerk!", but I guess not.

[Krausus]

The two are not comparable, especially considering how each successive victory in the Vale, or Cutter's, or Garuda/Ifrit EX are to the benefit of all present, and not one (or two) per run.

I would think that a person would put a little more effort into their replies on a topic like this than "oh yeah?! Well... you're a jerk!", but I guess not.

how are they not comparable? It's probably gonna take your average joe just as long to master a 17 minute speed run as it takes a group of 8 to get all their seals. This doesn't even take into account gearing up enough to even be able to do it.

[Eagleheart]

I like it well enough, are you speaking for the whole community?

A vast portion of it, yes. It is safe to speak tongue-in-cheek about combat content revolving around primarily non-combat classes.

[Krausus]

Here is a good quote that illustrates Vedis' incapacity to understand the issue being brought to topic in this thread.



Nothing about mastering Garuda speed run, Ifrit Extreme, or time attack AV/CC has to do with the problem of Provisioner and irritating drop rates when you have completed the event as required.

If you complete AV/CC 17 minute, you get your item.

If you complete Garuda speed run, you complete the task.

If you complete Ifrit Extreme, you complete the task.

If you complete HamDef 60k+, you might, if you are very fortunate, get your item, but probably not.

♪ One of these things is not like the others, one of these things does not belong~~~♪

the time and frustration it takes to get seals and the time and frustration it takes to master the other content is comparable.

You know for someone that spouts "commonsense" so much I would think I wouldn't have to explain that. Humph imagine that.