Future Endgame gear vs crafted gear with Materia.

[Noir]

So you are giving a hypothetical situation because YOU don't have 5.5k hp. It is possible, not probable, but it COULD happen, just YOU don't. Matter of fact, on your PLD or even WAR (If you are an HP tanking war you are bad, so IDC about war since I'll rip off you in 2 nukes with all HP) IDK if its even possible to hit 5.5 HP even if you had quad melded tier 4s.

You do realize in order for you to hit 5.5k, you would need Quad melded HP gear or better which I can guarantee you don't since the HP you would need to quad wouldn't realistically be possible. How about you go look at the AH and pull at your calculator, because obviously you don't know what you are talking about.

If he is lying or not I can't say. What I can say is that I have seen a guy with 5.5k hp on my server. Had quadra chest, triple sentinel boots, head and gloves and legs. And Garuda axe. Since I wasnt in a party I can't be 100% but by some adding calculations and bonus full party he was close or at that. Think he was called tatsuki homaru if I'm not mistaken.

[Amsai]

If you aren't a liar provide some kind of proof. Yes, we did catch you.

Welcome to FFXIV forums where threads don't stay on topic. Are you new here?

Touche! Youve got me there. You seem pretty funny, maybe you arent that bad a guy if you can make me laugh.

[Jeronlmo]

People assume PLD because you talked about HDL, you should not have even mentioned it if your talking about WAR... thats just crazy, HDL is obv dumb on WAR, you have no str/att or anything, just strait enmity, WAR holds hate threw dmg.... thats like mentioning INT gear for War or something.

[Dragon]

I'm going to agree with waht a couple of people have said.
Bring in Abj's.

For a long time in xi things like heca, shura, dalmaticas & zenith were incredibly sought after pieces. and they required buying a cursed dalmatica and then going out to kill odin or I forget which hnm to get the abjuration to purify it. required high level crafters and a decent group of people to do the fights. in many ways the perfect system.

Other examples included things like the scorpion harnesses and haubies etc. considered incribly strong pieces and required drops from various hnm/ksnm kinda stuff. all crafted items and for along time amoung the best available. still crafted but often required a fight somewhere to obtain the materials

Yeah, something like this.

I mean, who says you can't have endgame drops consist of ingredients instead of armor? Been done, and much better this way.

It could even be further integrated into the Materia system we have now to give a better balance, imagine it: let's take a Cursed Body that someone crafts, then take your abjuration, and finally you have to hunt for a raid-only materia that itself has to be "uncursed".

[Airget]

Yeah, something like this.

I mean, who says you can't have endgame drops consist of ingredients instead of armor? Been done, and much better this way.

It could even be further integrated into the Materia system we have now to give a better balance, imagine it: let's take a Cursed Body that someone crafts, then take your abjuration, and finally you have to hunt for a raid-only materia that itself has to be "uncursed".

DOL, they are already doing it with the Vampire plant, if they add to many ingredients gained through DOW/DOM then what purpose does DOL serve in all of this?

Rather than ingredients perhaps something more evil. Schematics which can only be used a certain amount of times ranging from NQ 3 to HQ +3 10 charges.

Basically these schematics would allow a crafter to craft said piece 3-10 times based on how many charges they've purchased and once done they wouldn't be able to synth it again til they got their hands on the schematics again.

The only way you can obtain these schematics is through DOW/DOM dungeons so a new synergistic path would be create in which DOM/DOM <--->DOH are relying on one another rather than the current DOM/DOW -Needs-> DOH <-Needs-> DOL
-------------------------

Perhaps a schematic could be 50& of the strength of the rare drop in said dungeon while the HQ version could be 75% strength of the rare armor HOWEVER you would be able to put materia on these pieces of armor which would allow those willing to risk it to produce something stronger then say

Darklight Cuirass
Str : +15, Vit : +15, Attack Power : +20, Crit Attack Power : +50, Evasion : -10, Healing Magic Potency : -30
NQ Synth (Meldable):
Str : +7, Vit : +7, Attack Power : +10, Crit Attack Power : +25, Evasion : -20, Healing Magic Potency : -60
HQ Synth (Meldable):
Str : +11, Vit : +11, Attack Power : +15, Crit Attack Power : +38, Evasion : -15, Healing Magic Potency : -45

Or perhaps let's say with the above you fight the chimera and beat him in 25 mins. By doing that you are guaranteed to get the "Synthetic Darklight Cuirass" Schematc which can range from 1-10 charges depending on how lucky you are. Or course you would be able to sell these through the MW or give them to your fellow LS crafters.

I think this would be a better way to balance the usefulness of dungeons without making DOH gear incompetent to use. With the above you have the choice of sticking with the "Darklight Cuirass" if that's what you want and are happy with those stats, or you can take a hit on the stats offered and try your luck at melding to customize your needs.

[RathSkybreaker]

He has many good points, though he has bad points as well. I'll comment on the posts I agree with.

Should raid gear be BIS compared to materia ?
Probably..
otherwise I don't see the point in doing raids when I can just spend the time to solo spirit bind and make good gear..

Do I want crafters completely out of the picture?

No, but I shouldn't HAVE to level a craft / gathering job to get the best gear for a DoW / DoM - ala hamlet. Hopefully higher tiers fix this. Btw, Yes I know you can play whm/war but that's not what I'm asking for. I like the abj. system a lot, much like the HNM system we have with uraeus etc.

Do the vast majority of players whom play MMOs like crafting /gathering?

Hell no, it's easy as hell in WoW and people refuse to do it there. Normal casuals, who outnumber us 100 : 1 would NEVER touch our current crafting system, it's not as bad as XI's but it's pretty close and look what happened there.

Luckily they are fixing crafting / gathering, hopefully it's funner. For me, and many others, crafting is an extremely boring process that pretty much forces me to go into auto-pilot and watch a movie. Hitting enter through muscle memory and trying to phase out the fact that I'm doing something so ridiculously boring.

I shouldn't have to do that, I should be having fun. No one is telling me to level crafts, but it should be encouraged, not something for sado-masochist , or the rare person that enjoys this type of system.

[Ryans]

I give up. Ive been lying the whole time, you guys caught me......... yea right.

I suppose its me own fault for trying to reason with idiots and children

Here is an interesting scenario:
First I am called a bad tank, because of the excess HPs. Then I am called a liar, because of the excess HPs.
Im confused, which is it?

Just going to throw my two cents in on this argument. Lying and being a bad tank aren't mutually exclusive, you can be both.

[Firon]

Me........

I always tank in heavy melded HP gear, with a some enmity and acc thrown in. I have 2 basic sets:
Set 1 is mostly HPs and with food gets me to 5.5k+ HPs
Set 2 is mostly HPs (4700ish w/ food) and about +60 eva and +60 parry

Heavy Dark light is trash for straight tanking say Coincounter and Ive passed on it quite a few times. Maybe if they made it wit a bit more survivabilty built in it would be OK, but all that enmity is overkill and not really needed. I can garuntee you this, I wouldnt be able to straight tank Coincounter and stand up to multiple blows with full HDL.

Now that being said DL gear does have some good pieces, but I wouldnt tank in any of it.

pics plz i wanna see this 5.5k hp pld/war with melds cause i think its bs i know a pld on Sarg with triple hp tier III meld in all slots you can get it in and does not have 5.5k hp.

[Disc]

I give up. Ive been lying the whole time, you guys caught me......... yea right.

I suppose its me own fault for trying to reason with idiots and children

Here is an interesting scenario:
First I am called a bad tank, because of the excess HPs. Then I am called a liar, because of the excess HPs.
Im confused, which is it?
So If I am a bad tank then why does my LS get wins.
Additionally, if I am a liar, why wouldnt I just lie and say I tank well with normal gear or naked. Why would I have such an elaborate story about the HPs when I could just say I am a godly tank that tanks in WAR AF?

Im done with this topic, I dont really need to show evidence to anyone, frankly I am a little shocked that its even being brought into question. And so I have humored some of you long enough. Now If you'd be so kind, can we get back to the original topic please?

Perhaps you're a bad tank for using full HP equipment on Warrior when nobody else needs it, perhaps you were stretching the truth when you said you hit 5.5k HP? Perhaps your LS is making up for your slack?

As a Lv 50 Warrior I have 3,420 base HP. That means you need +2,080HP from equipment/food/potions. Giant's Drink(300) + Trapper's Quiche(230) comes out to about 530HP if you have 4600 to begin with. So you're looking at 1180HP from gear alone.

Not counting Flame bonus, the highest HP from an earring is +25.
Best in necklace is +35.
Bracelet is +45.
Ring is +40(80).

We're at 3,585 HP.
You need 1,015HP from 6 pieces of equipment.
Weapon: Storm Sergeant's Axe HP+50
Head: Cobalt Celata+1 HP+54
Body: Cobalt Cuirass HP+72
Hands: Heavy Darksteel Gauntlets HP+40
Waist: Peistskin Hunting Belt+1 HP+9
Legs: Boarskin Skit+1 HP+33
Feet: Cobalt Sabatons+1 HP+36
Total non-melded: 294

You need 721HP from Materia to make this work.
Tier III maxes out at 50HP per materia, Tier IV at 70. You have 5 pieces of meldable gear.
You need four pieces with double & one with triple Tier IV, or Triple Tier III in all slots.

You'll have given up so many offensive stats that you will hit less than 70% of the time for who knows how much less than any other WAR would, with noticeably less enmity.

Is it possible to hit 5,500HP? Yes. Likely? No. Worth it? Most definitely not. Would your performance be lacking compared to a full AF WAR with electrum rings? Yes.

Edit-Oops, I only counted HP required(4600) for reaching the +530 bonus from food/potion for 5130HP total. Gimme a sec to recount the materia needed to make that extra 370HP for 5500.

Ok, we can count the 10% full party bonus & take off one or two melds or a ring. Or we can not count the full party bonus & require quad Tier IV melds on all pieces.

Math may be a few points off, little fatigued. Point still stands though.

[MicahZerrshia]

Hello,

I'm not sure it is fair to say 'the vast majority' do not care about crafting. Per the player's poll:
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...IX-(06-04-2012)

Only about 31% of players do not care about crafting. A sizable minority, but not a vast majority.

Although the majority of people may want battle related content, that is not to say that they do NOT want non-battle related content. It is reasonable for one to want both, and there to be enough interest in both. Again from the poll:

20.3% of people have a Level 40+ crafting job (therefore a keen interest in crafting)
20.8% of people have a Level 40+ gathering job (therefore a keen interest in gathering)

In fact, only 7.3% of people said they had no interest in gathering. Therefore one could say only 7.3% of people had an interest in battle-related-only content?

But, putting aside the possible mis-proportion of how many people want what, and dig into the premise of your argument:

The main thing here is that after nearly 2 years only 20.3% of players have a DoH and 28.8% of ppl have a DoL over 40. Which means that there are alot of ppl who most likely started to craft and quit or are interested but are casuals who do not want to put all their in-game time into beating their enter button to lvl one up. The 'no interest' ppl are usually the ones who have never picked up a tool.

So really there wasn't much mis-proportion of what ppl want in his post. He just looked at it from a different angle. But if you want to argue he is skewing the numbers to support his argument you must admit you are as well. Cause that middle ground is ambiguous at best