Skill trees and Alternate Advancement

[Mirage]

The way i see it, subjobs in FF11 were the "specs" in that game. In FF14, the skills we set from other classes is how we "spec" in this game.

I don't see a purpose in a skill tree system in this game. I'd rather expand on the multi-class possibilities that we are used to both in this game, and in previous final fantasy games.

However, I wouldn't mind a tiny bit of specialization such as what we got with merits in FF11.

[Jynx]

Give us some diversity, but like XI make it so it's not permanent but a ask in itself to "Respec" your class.

I think we can all understand the pain of making a thunder buffed Blackmage to find out that Ice is in next patch and have no recourse to change. At least in XI if your merit choices fell flat you always had a choice to get the merits again and replace some of those skills with others.

I agree that we need more diversity within our class/jobs. Nothing sucks more than knowing that once I'm maxed out I'll be just like everyone else and I can't get some quirky but usefull skills that nobody else thought of using.

[Rannie]

honestly... when i think of skill trees i think of Diablo 2 which was a great game and all but meh to me it doesn't go too well with this game. Also think of it this way a person can have the best gear best of everything and can't play their job worth crap so yeah I don't want a skill tree in this game

[Onisake]

Just want to be able to customise my character further that doesnt revolve solely around gear or a linear progression such as levels.

customization is very easy in this game. your 'tree branch' is your secondary pool of skills. you have a given set you will always have from your class. you can gain additional abilities via job.

the secondary abilties you bring from your subclasses is what allows you to customize. want heals? take cure from CNJ on your class.

want to be an offensive PLD? take more skills from MRD than CNJ sub.

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

tldr: I'm harkening back toward the concepts around FFXIV launch. Some blending in with job system.

Extended:
This is the way I *thought* it was going to be:

1. One set of stats to govern all character classes.
2. The ability to invest in elemental attributes.
3. Stat investment being more transparent in determining how effective the stat was.
4. Stat preferences play the role in class effectiveness until point reallocation.
5. An option for auto-point allocation for players not interested in manual distribution.

Elemental Example:

• A Gladiator who invested in the Fire attribute would have a stronger Red Lotus (sword attack with fire damage). This Gladiator takes less damage from fire attacks.
• A Marauder investing in the Wind attribute may have a stronger Iron Tempest (donut axe with wind damage). This Marauder takes less damage from wind attacks.
• A Black Mage investing in the Fire attribute would have stronger Fire and Firaga spells. This Black Mage takes less damage from fire attacks. His offensive capability against Ifrit may decline, but his ability to survive against fire attacks could make up for this.

One Set of Stats for All Classes:

• Balanced: Players may allocate their attribute points to become balanced, thus being able to fulfill the role of tank, damage dealer, debuffer, healer, gatherer, or crafter on an effective level.
• Defender: Players might allocate their attribute points toward increasing their HP, physical, magic defense, and chance to block. This player may be more suited for tanking roles such as Gladiator, Marauder, or Community Rep. This player may also be suited for mining or Hand classes that take advantage of their stats.
• Physical Offense: Allocating toward strength, accuracy, and perhaps some survivability to endure area attacks. This player may be more suited to physical attackers such as Pugilist, Archer, Lancer, or using Marauder offensively. These individuals may also make good blacksmiths.
• Magic Offense: Allocating toward intelligence, magic accuracy, and having a larger pool of MP. This player may have little regard for physical offense or resistance toward physical attacks. This player may be more suited toward Thaumaturge, an offensive Conjurer, or a Monk.
• Support: Allocating toward healing potency, enhancement potency, and large MP pools. This player may not be able to deal as much damage as others, but may be more suited toward a healing or enhancement role.

Auto-Allocation toward a particular class or play style for players not interested in this type of customization. The default setting might have been set for balanced stats so that players could continue to experiment with all classes until they found their favored play style.

Though not quite what the OP is asking for, I think this would have allowed for some "individualization".

Granted, I think only the players seeking maximized performance across multiple jobs would have been impacted most by this style. Where the auto is meant as a deterrent for players overwhelmed by the question "What is good for me? I just want to heal you (in my underwear and not die)."

[JDR388]

While I love skill trees for offline games where I can progress with whatever I think is cool. In an MMO it's only a matter of time before someone figures out what build is best dps, tank or healer and it stops being a choice ( basicly it's a calculation where there is a path that gives the best result disguised as a choice where all paths give equil results)

He speaks the truth!

As a long time WoW player I quickly came to realize that the various talent trees only offered something of a faux choice in every patch if the player wants to maintain an optimum dps throughput (something that blizzard itself seems to be aware of as they are completely retooling how their talent system works to make it much more difficult to weigh the value of certain abilities).

There is something to be said, however, for having the ability to adjust ones charecter traits even if the choice is something of an illusion for endgame players. All in all I thing that adding a system like merits from XI or a system based on talent trees would bring more good to the game then harm. I would of course expect Yoshida to put his own spin on it, however.

[DeadRiser]

Not sure how this has anything to do with what I said. But on the subject no class should be excluded from Ifrit, I mean it is Ifrit for gods sakes....

Just like no skill tree or whatever should be excluded from content. Each would have it's use, people will nit pick whatever but they will eventually get over it.

[Andrien]

everyone is pretty much the same right now, and the only difference between each individual is perhaps their materia setup and accessories. Maybe Yoshi-P can think of something cool if they do this skill-tree.

[Fiosha_Maureiba]

Returning to this topic from a "where do we go from here" standpoint. Providing a sense of alternate advancement. And providing the framework for a system so ZANY, it'll never get used (and also to incorporate RNG into it somehow).

Concept: All your excess EXP at Level 50 is stored up into a pool of... Excess EXP (we'll call it that and it in no way can be used to level you up once level cap is increased).

Excess EXP can be exchanged at guilds for unique materia of your choosing. But if we want to RNG it, the guild will hand you a random unique materia. If you get the same one twice, it goes the way of a primal weapon...

This unique materia provides traits that may reduce the cooldown of an ability (Swift War Drum, Swift Sacred Prism), reduce the TP cost of a weapon skill, reduce the MP cost of a magic spell, add an additional effect to an existing ability (i.e. Enhanced Cover, Enhanced Protect), or provide some other unique effect (successful parries increase TP, resisting a spell restores some MP, auto attack has a chance to afflict a debuff).

To make this materia more attractive, it would have a higher meld success rate than other materia. To make you cry, if you try to fit multiple unique materia on to have awesome traits, you could blow the item up just like any other materia. But don't worry, your excess XP wasn't getting used anyway, so it's like you didn't lose anything to begin with? Maybe...? Not really.

Rested bonus gets used up to accelerate the gain of this Excess XP.

But as this is not a guaranteed form of advancement, perhaps I will wait until 2.0 and put forth the suggestion of this...

tldr: Please add materia with traits.

[Krausus]

Just like no skill tree or whatever should be excluded from content. Each would have it's use, people will nit pick whatever but they will eventually get over it.

no its not the same, your argument is people laugh at you for bringing WAR for Ifrit. 2 things make that a moot point. 1 Ifirit is not so hard that you have to have xyz classes to succeed outside of needing healer and tank at the very least. And 2. WAR is a good class with high survivability very good self heals, and pretty good damage. A better argument would be people laugh at me for bringing MRD which would be the equivalent of bringing a shitty skill tree speced WAR vs a good skill tree speced WAR

EDIT: I now see you actually did say MRD...yeah I would laugh at you to, sorry you are gimping yourself and your party.