8.0 speculation

[Bright-Flower]

I dont see why we had any interest or stake in the succession of a foreign continent of baby sacrificing savages that cant even grow their own food.
Especially to the point of fighting each other over it after everything the scions have been through together. Im glad that proposed plot point of opposing scions ended up forgotten about.

The idea of the scions having a serious schism and seriously fighting one another was never really on the table. But the idea of friendly competition, with different scions having their reasons for backing different candidates, could have led to some fun interactions before they eventually inevitably reconcile and unite again.

Remember that most of the scions also have scholarly backgrounds. They could have had actual interesting discussions on the subject. Instead of the nothing burger we ended up with. It made me want to pull my hair out when the Twins went to the New World ostensibly to learn things to help Garlemald, only for nothing of interesting to happen with that idea all expansion, and then to end with them coming back to Jules to say 'understanding people is good. '

Instead we just get Thancred slightly inconveniencing us in the first dungeon and then nothing else, which was kind of dull. Why bother to tease that story thread at all if it wasn't going to lead to anything?

It reminds me of the whole 'become what you must. Become the warrior of darkness' thing. Obviously the WOL was never going to become a villain but it ended up meaning nothing except a change in terminology and it was actually the blessing of light in the first place that allowed us to fill that role. People are going to be disapointed when a potentially interesting story angle is brought up but then not explored in an interesting way.

[Cleretic]

I dont see why we had any interest or stake in the succession of a foreign continent of baby sacrificing savages that cant even grow their own food.
Especially to the point of fighting each other over it after everything the scions have been through together. Im glad that proposed plot point of opposing scions ended up forgotten about.

...okay that is a CONCERNINGLY bad read of Dawntrail to the point where I'm not sure it's worth refuting, I don't think this is possibly a comment made in good faith. But, here we go.

The reason we (and Thancred and Urianger) turned up is literally because we were asked, but all of the characters involved are broadly humanitarian; they want the best for everyone, and 'everyone' includes the people of this nation that they've never been to.

That nation is not 'baby sacrificing savages' oh my god how did you even GET here. Tural is certainly less technologically advanced than the Eorzean average, but that does not make them lesser people, and certainly not 'savages'; in fact, there's a solid case that Eorzea is more savage than Tural, because Tural's different races are all really friendly to each other, and nobody in Tural has been performing human sacrifices in recent history. Tural's pretty great, they just haven't figured out, like... ocean-faring boats.

The exception is Mamook, but Mamook also are not 'baby sacrificing savages', and aren't really indicative of anything greater. Mamook's just a conservative town that doesn't know how to solve their own problems, and have an old-fashioned outlook doing them more harm than good; they aren't 'sacrificing babies', they have an outlook causing a REALLY haunting infant mortality rate. Not only would basing your entire read on Tural on this reading of Mamook be like me basing my opinion of the entire U.S. on the worst possible reading of Tennessee, Mamook are also just also people who deserve help. They're just a warmer, blue version of Garlemald, and we're also helping Garlemald.


I've also over time just stopped caring about people bringing up that 'the Scions didn't really have conflict' side of things, because... frankly, that was one slide of fanfest hype. It was clearly marketing copy, and I care little about it in Dawntrail in the same way that I care little about the 'become what you must' hinting for Shadowbringers. And I think given context it actually makes more sense that they didn't clash, because the clash between Wuk Lamat and Koana was always pretty tepid and good-natured; both sides agree that Zoraal Ja really had to be stopped, and beyond that the clash is clearly between two figures with mutual respect but different outlooks. It makes complete sense that the Scions never really clashed outside of some good-natured slowdown tactics in Ihuykatumu; there's no ire or animosity here. They're basically just playing for two different teams. Would've been kinda neat to have a 'Thancred and Urianger' boss fight in the middle of that dungeon, but I don't think we needed that, and anything more might've actually detracted from the real focus.

[MikkoAkure]

Not sure if this was an angle anyone else thought of when trying to determine the new jobs from Yoshi-P’s shirt, but I decided to take a look at the Roegadyn dictionary on this forum and Rhitahtyn’s name translates to Right Judge.

It would be neat if the new job was called Judge and was linked to the shirt via the Roegadyn language.

[Cilia]

Not sure if this was an angle anyone else thought of when trying to determine the new jobs from Yoshi-P’s shirt, but I decided to take a look at the Roegadyn dictionary on this forum and Rhitahtyn’s name translates to Right Judge.

It would be neat if the new job was called Judge and was linked to the shirt via the Roegadyn language.

Judge is a very Ivalice-coded Job, and it's already been stated that the new Evercold Jobs are both going to be XIV originals.

Besides which Judge is more of a title than a proper Job; the most iconic examples, XII's Judge Magisters, all wield differing arrays of weapons. Not exactly conducive to a codified combat style. (Would I be stoked if they added Gabranth's moves as a VPR alternate skin or whatever? Yes, I mained him in Dissidia. Still.) If anything I'm expecting it to be Viking-adjacent; an offshoot of the WAR combat style with dual shields or something.

[MikkoAkure]

Judge is a very Ivalice-coded Job, and it's already been stated that the new Evercold Jobs are both going to be XIV originals.

Besides which Judge is more of a title than a proper Job; the most iconic examples, XII's Judge Magisters, all wield differing arrays of weapons. Not exactly conducive to a codified combat style. (Would I be stoked if they added Gabranth's moves as a VPR alternate skin or whatever? Yes, I mained him in Dissidia. Still.) If anything I'm expecting it to be Viking-adjacent; an offshoot of the WAR combat style with dual shields or something.

I thought it was said that the new jobs aren't going to be existing, classic FF jobs and Judge was never a job. This leaves the field wide open for weapon types, though I'm betting on at least one shield since it will share a niche with Paladin. And if the devs wanted to be extra awesome, laws that cause debuffs.

I'm not personally expecting anything viking-adjacent. All new jobs have to start in one of the three starter cities which means that the new job cannot be from the Fourth. Gunbreaker and Dancer had absolutely nothing to do with the First in the other shard-focused expansion we had.

[Cilia]

I thought it was said that the new jobs aren't going to be existing, classic FF jobs and Judge was never a job. This leaves the field wide open for weapon types, though I'm betting on at least one shield since it will share a niche with Paladin. And if the devs wanted to be extra awesome, laws that cause debuffs.

I'm not personally expecting anything viking-adjacent. All new jobs have to start in one of the three starter cities which means that the new job cannot be from the Fourth. Gunbreaker and Dancer had absolutely nothing to do with the First in the other shard-focused expansion we had.

Judge first appeared (as a playable Job, even) in Tactics Advance. It also isn't historically related to shields; XII's iconic Judge Magisters all use combining dual weapons (akin to VPR), though lesser Judges and the original Judgemaster (or Judge Magister) Cid Randell from TA could equip them.

I say Viking (or something adjacent) because while new Jobs necessarily start in one of the starting three city-states, Roegadyn culture (Roegadyn, not Limsan) has been subtly viking-coded for quite a long time. The Sea Wolves could be argued to resemble viking raiders before settling down on Vylbrand, and the Hellsguard (from which the Warrior Job descends in-universe) give off the generally warlike demeanor associated with vikings, on top of WAR having several viking-coded artifact armor sets. Additionally, Rhitahtyn's weapon loadout of choice was two (gun)shields; dual-wielding shields was the optimal way to use Viking in III (or at least the remake). WAR does already have access to some hammer-type weapons (Viking's main offensive equipment) though, and a whole fighting style based on two shields would be a little wonky.

And we could always just have a Blindfrost native show up and teach us whatever it is, if it's related to Roegadyn culture. Since new Jobs necessarily start in one of the three base city-states (after the headache with DRK, MCH, and AST) that's how they go anyway.

[Cleretic]

I don't have any predictions for the tank, but I am willing to predict that the ranged physical job will be Viper's style of 'original' and basically just be Wakka and/or Hope.

Right now I'm more invested in 'oh god I hope they don't ruin healers', but that's unrelated to lore.

[RavLandslide]

I'm not personally expecting anything viking-adjacent. All new jobs have to start in one of the three starter cities which means that the new job cannot be from the Fourth. Gunbreaker and Dancer had absolutely nothing to do with the First in the other shard-focused expansion we had.

While it can't be from the Fourth it could be from Aerslaent, which is supposedly very Norse/viking-adjacent.

I don't have any predictions for the tank, but I am willing to predict that the ranged physical job will be Viper's style of 'original' and basically just be Wakka and/or Hope.

Did the devs not say that while the new jobs will be FFXIV OriginalsTM they would be "returning in a way"? While I would love not-Blitzballer as a job, I sadly can't imagine that lining up with the devs' comment unlike something like Musketeer which has an unused guild in Limsa. Unless that quote was just a mistranslation/false info.

[MikkoAkure]

Judge first appeared (as a playable Job, even) in Tactics Advance. It also isn't historically related to shields; XII's iconic Judge Magisters all use combining dual weapons (akin to VPR), though lesser Judges and the original Judgemaster (or Judge Magister) Cid Randell from TA could equip them.

Calling Judge a “playable job” when it was only ever available to one single optional character is a bit of a stretch. I wouldn’t consider any of the FFTA/FFTA2 unique character classes isolated to one person as “FF jobs”, same as gameplay tied to individual characters and not linked to classic FF jobs. I wouldn't call Squall being a gunblade user a "FF job" and I was under the impression that Yoshi-P’s quote had to do with actual jobs from the series.

As someone whose first FF game ever was FFTA and since then attributes FF as a whole to Ivalice, it would be nice to have a job that’s Ivalice-inspired similar to what we’ve had with FFVIII with GNB and sort of FFIX with VPR.

And we could always just have a Blindfrost native show up and teach us whatever it is, if it's related to Roegadyn culture.

The area of the Blindfrost has absolutely nothing to do with Roegadyn at all as far as we know and is on the opposite side of the world from their homeland so I don’t expect that to change. There’s Xaela there though.

Did the devs not say that while the new jobs will be FFXIV OriginalsTM they would be "returning in a way"? While I would love not-Blitzballer as a job, I sadly can't imagine that lining up with the devs' comment unlike something like Musketeer which has an unused guild in Limsa. Unless that quote was just a mistranslation/false info.

While I had wanted Musketeer since 1.0 beta when we were told it was going to be in release (and IIRC was even on the official website), Machinist has taken everything over in regards to it and has spiritually succeeded it to the point I don’t see it arriving in any form. MCH job quests even have Limsans train Ishgardians on how to use guns and they brought back my favorite lost 1.0 NPC just for that. And the Musketeer’s Guild isn’t unused, it’s the Marauder’s Guild now. Even though the old 1.0 version of the pirate ship was much better.

I can't find the quote where Yoshi-P talked about the new job not being an old job, but I did find other people talking about Judge, which makes me feel less clever than I thought I was.

[Cleretic]

Did the devs not say that while the new jobs will be FFXIV OriginalsTM they would be "returning in a way"? While I would love not-Blitzballer as a job, I sadly can't imagine that lining up with the devs' comment unlike something like Musketeer which has an unused guild in Limsa. Unless that quote was just a mistranslation/false info.

They said that the jobs would be originals, but they also act like Viper is 'original', and it's not.

Also, Musketeer is probably permanently on the shelf because they tried to crack that thing from 1.0 through to Heavensward before eventually going 'this isn't working, Machinist will'. My guess has always been that they ran headlong into the same problem every single MMO since FFXI has faced, that 'Shoots Good' is not enough of a gimmick to make a whole job skillset out of, you need to add something else. And so Machinist solved the Musketeer problem by adding gadgets.