Sincere Question...No Troll...Has SE Gone Full Regress?!?!

[VeyaAkemi]

The journey of *checks notes* grinding FATEs

Yes, exactly, it is a grind that requires commitment, and that's exactly what I want, I don't want to just do things, I want to have a reason to do things, and Relics give me that reason, every relic barring EW ones involved some form of FATE farming, if you just consider NMs to be boss FATEs with extra steps, and I enjoyed all of them, it is the moment to moment, talking about what I was doing with people, so on, ultimately the journey is the process of going out and doing things, of interacting with the game world, even if just flying back and forth while occasionally talking to people, that's the journey, and I value what I had with it.

I guess I just really don't like grinding for the sake of grinding.

And that's fine, but relics have, historically, been intensive grinds, 5 out of 6 relics series, counting Phantom Weapons already, have been intensive grinds, so that's what they are supposed to be, and people like me who enjoy those grinds are always happy to get them, and I personally think it's a shame for them be asked to be anything lesser than that, it means losing a form of content I enjoy a great deal.

Also frankly, I fully expect the process to be nerfed in 8.0, literally every single Relic series has been nerfed once their time in the limelight has passed, the Demi Atmas that people complained so much about will be 50% chance to guaranteed in a year's time from OC Critical Encounters, and 20% or more from FATEs, so if you feel dealing with it right now isn't worth the hassle, wait it out.

[Avenheit]

I'll agree Occult Crescent is a major step backwards after Bozja, I spent days in Bozja just doing fates, farming Dalriada and such, it was genuinely fun, but regarding the atma grind, people were so up in arms about Endwalker relics being just "Get tomes" they were very vocal that relics SHOULD be a grind, and SE now made the first step a grind and subsequent relics after the first one just tomes.

Is it the right path for relics? Not my place to say, there will always be those who are unhappy with any path, I just hope if we get a new field exploration in 8.0 it'll be better than Occult Crescent. But, I do not think they want their game to fail. I think as always with an MMO, it's just really hard to please everyone.

Bozja was a side step of Eureka, and OC was a backstep of the both of em.

I was promised the best of both, and recieved neither.

[TeresaFortell]

The Regression: From Bozja to This?
How do we go from Shadowbringers, which gave us amazing content like Bozja and Zadnor, back to 2.0-era mechanics? Bozja has a purpose even today. You can gain experience, level alternate jobs, and engage in a unique ecosystem.
Occult Crescent has zero purpose once you finish your glam weapon. After 7.5 and the launch of 8.0, it will be a almost a ghost town because the leveling system is restricted only to that zone. Why create content that has no viability outside of the current expansion? It’s a massive, uninspired waste of resources.

That would have been fine had its loot been entirely exclusive from other content. The bigger issue was that it carried the loot from the eureka and bozja. While this might have been unintended, the implication was that it significantly diminished the need for people to do those contents, as they can simply do Occult.

[Absurdity]

I would pretty much agree... OC is probably the worst exploratory content we've had, at its core..

I would also say, I wouldn't use Eureka as indicative of how alive or not this content will be.. Eureka has the benefit of... To do the relics, you must do Eureka.. Not only that all steps for the relic are contained in Eureka..

Step 1: You can do FATEs or you can do OC... They are probably going to increase the rate in 8/0 for FATEs.
Step 2: Has no involvement in OC whatsoever... Do a bit of crafting, do your roulettes (which you were doing anyway)

I actually found this step to be worse than the atma grind.

Because it forces you into a single piece of content again, the 4 different roulettes it wants you to do. Eureka had multiple things you could be working on alongside grinding for your relic and even the atma at least gave you the option to just do zone fates instead of OC.
I'm not getting anything out of those roulettes and since I absolutely despise how the game plays at low level, which is most likely what you'll get, I have to force myself to do it.

[Daralii]

Bozja was a side step of Eureka, and OC was a backstep of the both of em.

I was promised the best of both, and recieved neither.

The players in Yoshida's head longed for a return to BA's entry system.

[Commander_Justitia]

Are you really comparing a fate grind with a fate grind? And then praise one and criticize the other? Ok.
I think they should be doing something with leaves, the system feels so useless currently. They should be doing something with GC rank. I would have liked to see that progression in a "open world deep dungeon" is tied to relic progress of your server. Unless your server clears certain levels and stages, you won't get access to the next upgrade. Make guilds and their leaders have special guild buffs for such content, let their banner be risen on a completed stage, so everyone knows who cleared the floor - or recleared it. Let the guild who captured it decide how to develop the area further, similar to Ishgard Restoration.

Give purpose to the existing systems. SE has to decide if they wanna be a MMORPG, making content for more than 1 player, or not.

[justausername]

I mean sure, it was kinda annoying. But its once. After that all you need is tomes. And the next step isn't atma either.
I much rather this then w/e ShB was. I remember trying for months to get those. Then had to try for months again for another job. And again for another. And bozja was the worst thing ever ugh I HATE it. Bozja was like 0/10, OC is at least 5/10 (if Forked Tower was actually good itd be higher)

[theunhappypotato]

Or we could, you know, have some actually engaging content that people do because it's enjoyable, not just because it takes forever.

idk man so far almost every piece of content i did so far was pretty ennjoyable enganging even tho i havent done m5s-m8s and forked tower, so its fine to have a nice braindead grind every now and then and if you're not doing ults then you dont really have a need for the relic anyways

[MayuAmakura]

But, I do not think they want their game to fail. I think as always with an MMO, it's just really hard to please everyone.

Saying "It's really hard to please everyone" is a typical excuse that anyone can make to justify their bad game design. Notoriously more bad when players start defending bad actions altogether. Everyone can be satisfied if only devs were willing to step out of their formula and do something else but no let's put fate grinding system once again because that's the best we can do!

As for the game fall (which is certainly happening)... most companies don't really care. They don't give a flying sardine if you or 1000 others will leave as long as they have whales that will support the game big as a number of 500k users. A few whales are enough to make this game thrive without the need of others. They most certainly won't leave due to: "i spent enough, so i must stay and justify this" mentality.

There is a reason why many games are falling down massively but still get enough money that they simply wonder: "why even try, when low effort is working?" Yeah Exactly this. Devs don't even have to bother fixing anything when a slop is enough to make people stay.

[MayuAmakura]

idk man so far almost every piece of content i did so far was pretty ennjoyable enganging even tho i havent done m5s-m8s and forked tower, so its fine to have a nice braindead grind every now and then and if you're not doing ults then you dont really have a need for the relic anyways

Braindead grind is a bad game design when it has nothing else to offer. Simple as that. Considering that huge grind are mostly done with bots and 3rd party tools, that explains how "fun" they are.