Here we go again

[Atma]

Honestly I haven’t done Meso Terminal yet (ok maybe I forgot about the 7.2 trial lol), but whenever I see this topic I just think, ‘isn’t trust/npc runs already easy mode?’.

They're usually well-trained enough that you can easily follow / reflect what they to do to see mechanics resolved. Plus there’s weird stuff like their super condensed movesets having inflated potencies to try and make them a bit closer to what players do.

On DPS, dungeon trusts are IMHO actually hard mode compared to players. They will only heal so much "off-script". If you die, it is start over, not get ressed. You typically must actually learn the mechanic, you can't just coast through with extra effort from healers.

You can get away with so much more slop with actual players compared to relying on trust NPCs. Sure, you can follow them to safe spots, but for things like dungeon boss 2, that doesn't work.

That's just general commentary though. The biggest thing with MT Boss 2 is it is really the game's first "personal responsibility" boss where 85% of it is all on you. I thought invasion interesting, only opinion is the spike ball AOE range is a bit overtuned for the small space you have to work within.

[Bibine_Bine]

I did this as a healer and actually found it to be quite fun and engaging.
Skill issue I'm afraid.

[RedLolly]

The healer argument around the power of raidwides in casual content is one of the few truly problematic problems with casual balance of the internal healer balance because these raidwides ars a complete joke on the shield healers but can be annoying on the regen healers because you simply can’t mitigate them as effectively as the shields can

People in this game are trained to think the shields are harder for some reason but they are just genuinly better for literally every piece of content if you want to run a healer

Yep. I chose to get white mage to 100 as my healer. Everything seems to hit far harder than ever and I mitigate everything I possibly can.

What's personally frustrating is I used to main Scholar and leveled Sage because I liked shield healing, but found out with an old attempt at savage raiding that I "overhealed" in content and should be doing more DPS. So I completely swapped over and stopped being a healer main entirely.

But now I can barely keep up in basic content?

EDIT: People really missing the point OP was making that DT's content is the first time story content was physically impossible for them to do and it's not a matter of just building skill.

There is an argument to be made against DT's main story being objectively harder is pushing players out. People have been saying DT's just a bit too difficult since it launched.

[Bryson]

Yep. I chose to get white mage to 100 as my healer. Everything seems to hit far harder than ever and I mitigate everything I possibly can.

What's personally frustrating is I used to main Scholar and leveled Sage because I liked shield healing, but found out with an old attempt at savage raiding that I "overhealed" in content and should be doing more DPS. So I completely swapped over and stopped being a healer main entirely.

But now I can barely keep up in basic content?

that just means there's room for you to improve on healer.

[Bibine_Bine]

I did that with trusts so it reset when I died, what happens with that fight when someone dies? It didn't let the trusts help me with mine when they killed theirs, does it only let you fight them if the person dies? Or were the trusts just not programmed to help?

If you're in a party with others, you can get rezzed and resume on the enemy you were chained to initially by just going back in the circle. I'm not sure if it's completable without all 4 players, haven't seen that yet.

What the game needs is a freaking useful tutorial, and actual mentors, not the kind that play just for the icon.

Agree. This game's tutorial sucks. They've made it better but it's still not where it should be. I feel like there also needs to be a shift in community attitude towards allowing people to give new players advice and criticism. I'm a mentor and many times I feel like I have to hold my tongue because someone might react negatively to me telling someone they're doing wrong or asking someone politely to pick up the pace in a dungeon.

I don't think an easy mode is the solution you seek. What they should do is what they do in the Duty Support trials : have that stacked buff that lets you survive death twice before actually wiping. In dungeon with players difficulty is okay because even if you die, you can get a rez and things move forward. In Duty Support, the fight just wipes and it feels kinda bad and punishing for nothing.

I think this is a decent take, actually. I didn't even know that was a thing for trials since I rarely do trusts.

If you want to deal with these mechanics, the solution is to always play it safe and assume the worst : for these spiked balls, yes you don't see the AoEs at first, but you can guess that it's going to be a round shape. So the reflex to have is to go next to the wall, away in between two of them, and then you'll see the actual AoE and learn where to position for the next one.

I know the philosophy of the game is ABC : Always Be Casting, but really if this type of mechanic makes you struggle (which is fair, not pointing fingers), disengaging and focusing on your movement is a good way to solve them without dying too much.

This. If you're struggling it's better to just stop and pay attention to mechanics to resolve them rather than pushing yourself to do your rotation 100% of the time and dying.

[Bibine_Bine]

The healer argument around the power of raidwides in casual content is one of the few truly problematic problems with casual balance of the internal healer balance because these raidwides ars a complete joke on the shield healers but can be annoying on the regen healers because you simply can’t mitigate them as effectively as the shields can

People in this game are trained to think the shields are harder for some reason but they are just genuinly better for literally every piece of content if you want to run a healer

Depends. For casual content shield healing can be harder, because it benefits hugely from fight knowledge and anticipating damage. Regen healers are much better at recovering from mistakes. In a hardcore setting they become way better as you have better coordination and planning for mechanics.

I agree with most of the people in here about the game's difficulty. We don't need an easy mode, that'll just take dev time away from improvements that this game actually desperately needs.

[SyferU]

Had a Healer die at the Meso Terminal's second boss, used a Phoenix Down and everything was fine.
Even If you die as a healer, just get a rez from one of the dps it's fine.

[TaleraRistain]

It's MSQ content so it should be designed for everyone to be completed without much issues and not being a frustrating experience for some. I personally did not have any troubles with the new dungeon but I can clearly see why it is hard for others and can be impossible for some too, be it disabilities, age or any other circumstances.
In a week people will be clearing this blindfolded, yea maybe, it still doesn't address the actual issue tho. Those who struggle now due to the aforementioned reasons won't magically have these issues disappear in a week, plus I doubt they'll want to do this dungeon more often than necessary.

This. It's fine if a story mode in a game is designed around being easy and fun. That means everyone can have a chill, enjoyable experience while going through the story. Then we can make the argument that there can be more complexity in the optional content since it is optional content.

I've died like 5 times on that second boss. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but I'm gonna take a break from it and try again later. I'm only pushing 40, but some of those mechanics were just too fast for me.

Anyway that's my feedback and people will make fun of me forgetting that I am not them.

Anyway, I hope you guys luck in your next attempt.

Are you on dps? I always do my first run with Duty Support as a dps so I can properly learn the mechanics. There's something you have to kill and I couldn't really make it out at first so I died many times until I saw it.

I gather that mechanic changes based on your role.

[Bryson]

was done in response to hardcore content, Forked Tower in particular it seems.

Casuals were in my Forked Tower reclears.

[Mesarthim]

People need to stop being so dramatic. I'm nearly 40 and mastered the dungeon after 2 runs. My reflexes are only getting slower. The thing about this dungeon is nothing about it is new other than putting a spin on an already existing attack. We are well past the point of "only going to dodge if an orange puddle shows up".

I once had to unbreak a tank in savage before (casual group) because they kept being overwhelmed. I told him to stop focusing on irrelevant information. That fixed him. You have a lot of time to react to most mechanics in this dungeon. I just sort it out in my head and prune out the unnecessary info. Nothing here is a split second react mechanic.